Oriceles Tier List - 25/11/2018
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DateDescription
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25-11-2018One year passed and the powercreep finally managed to reach Atlantis, his current performance in recent stages is just... bah, feels more grind oriented than an efficient fast clear.
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I also want to take the time to say that most veterans and pro players hardly need a document like this, the tier list and meta analysis are oriented to the average player, yes those guys that hardly can spin more than 6 combos in the first batch and start to panic if they find themselves playing with a team without +2s of movement of runestones.
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The comments explaining the main difference from each tier are back, please don't consider those as something that is set in stone because you know that things in this game change quite fast every 5-6 months.
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Placement Changes
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Atlantis from S to A+
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The damage is not on par with other S leaders anymore, the damage reduction is there, but he struggles to go beyond 21k HP with the required utility, he is also forced to use Cassandra and Wen Zhong which used to be "core" but now they feel as "key", that lowers the amount of slots you have for utility members.
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Tang Sanzang from B+ to B-
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If I am pushing down Atlantis, I am obviously pushing down Tang Sanzang as well, I heard that some chinese players managed to clear all the new extras by using Tang Sanzang as leader, but still in the hands of the average player he won't be as efficient as other top tier leader we know.
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Maya B+ to B
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RNG Skydrops 🤷, even with super late PR Anu active she struggles to reach 2.1b.
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Saruman M
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Thanks to the new VR Dark Gnome team with costume is dealing really high damage and was able to clear Biggie Elite stage, yet as you know, you can't slot members other than Gnomes in that team so they can return to the M tier finally.
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12-11-2018In this version I am going to do some arbitrary changes that are necessary, some discussions are not that popular and for that very same reason many leaders get ignored and is my job to make you guys wonder about it.
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Primal Greek from A to B
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Despite of the fact that Gaia, Phanes and Aether do have some insane multipliers they do not offer as much utility as cards from limited time seals, and yet they are not so flexible as Greeks which provide a lower damage output but have excellent choices that go really well with them, let's say you can't compare Athena+Rakshasa with Gaia, and Athena recovery is also absurd thanks to her gameplay. In Aether case is the fact that good racial rainbow members like Fafnir or Ranto end up landing in light attribute as well, and getting other members of race and attribute that do well with her is complicated to achieve, also hard to master because she doesn't provide shared effect of runestones other than her active skill and no time extension either so it is hard to actually dissolve all the type of runestones and get decent combo count unless you are really skilled. This being said, there is no big particular reason to play this 3 leaders when compared to others available in Best Choice, their big multipliers are something that is not getting that exclusive either so yes, right now I see them as members from the standard damage tier rather than something outstanding.
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Nobunaga from B+ to B
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Hard time for Nobunaga, really. to get his full potential you are meant to either stack fire runestones or keep mass converting in order to get those 12 fire runestones, if he had acces to a skill that converted runestones in to fire every turn probably he could get some additional attention, also the fire dragon pool is not offering anything outstanding for him either.
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Uncle Tuu from B- to C+
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Nobody wants to pay a visit to the uncle, the condition to keep his multiplier is annoying and you are better playing Hideyoshi or any other Earth leader. Also popularity and availability affect the ratings in this tier list over long periods. So yes Richman is also part of the non-standard/underplayed/conditional/power creep'd tier.
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Lancelot from B- to C+
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Our fake FED Satan also got cut, he is not able to stand in the current standards for many drawbacks that would come from using him as leader. In the end we are better trying to play Xiahou Dun which is Lancelot 2.0.
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Su Huan Jen from A- to B+
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He can keep with meta stats and since he is not race locked you can try many members with him, but at the end of the day you won't see him ditch as much damage as modern day leaders.
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Priestess Xi form B+ to A-
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I know this might be a weird change, but after the heated discussions about Aqua vs Atlantis I noticed that healing without hearts is under appreciated and I did some decent runs and I have to say that her damage on raw with God runestones is about the same as Atlantis right now, this being said I think she deserves a bit more of love. Was this a swap with Su Huan Jen placement?, not exactly but yes, Su Huan Jen just offers 4.5x flat to the team along with shared effect of runestones, in 2 other types, but his main damage comes from leader and adjutant with the extra attacks, also yeah, he doesn't have a way to heal without hearts or recovery.
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KOF from C+ to C
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They are gone, and you won't see them returning, no popularity, no flexible building, no challenges that they can fight in 2018 almost 2019, so yeah, is time for them to hit C
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2-11-2018This week there was a hot debate on changing Atlantis placement to A+ and move Aqua to S, after the entire week we came to the conclusion that Atlantis is missing damage right now and can't get absurd HP like Yusuke, yet he is still great and all, Aqua have amazing tools but some conditions can't be triggered all the time so she does have a limit. That being said I will keep playing both since there are different scenarios for each of them.
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Under observation
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Crimson Grace recently got Robert PR which basically turns him in to a key member, problem with this team is that they continue on the same line of high damage and low defense, yet the new control skill should help to deal against enemy retaliations and improve their viability. This being said I doubt that they can get a better placement in the Tier List, probably C+ and green border (assuming robert present) is their limit. Meta effective HP is around 21k right now.
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KOF is staying at C+ during this update, but I think they could go down soon, they are not ditching the proper damage and their popularity is completly fading, they are more common as members nowadays.
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Placement Changes
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Sun Ce from A- to B+
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I don't know how many times we have moved Sun Ce this year. He is not a bad leader, it's just that Madhead doesn't want to give defensive tools to a leader that is locked in to human race and having high damage output. At this point I do consider that Imperial Warlords 2 need another revamp, specially because they missed Zhurong in the previous update.
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26-10-2018Not much in this update, been kinda busy this week but I will try to catch up before next patch arrives.
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Placement changes:
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Megumin, Darkness and Aqua get green border removed
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Their performance was tested more than enough and I haven't received more feedback about placement changes.
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Yog Sothot from B+ to B-
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After some horrendous attempts of leader and adjutant Yog at the "Lurking of Demons" stage we came up with the conclusion that Yog have turned unpractical and despite of having very notorious tools her damage is not on current standards. This needs more feedback, but she might end up in C tier after a while.
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Hiei from A to A+
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Originally his placement was decided without much test and folks over Discord were not pleased with the stat multiplier being reserved solely for demons, but since 10th seal narrows the choices he and the rest of the demon pool started to receive more attention. Then he got all the attention during the "Lurking of Demons" stage. So for now we can say that he is probably the best demon leader out there.
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Daoloth from A+ to A
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This change comes from the fact that he is lacking presence and is in need of some additional tools, specially more elfs to choose from.
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Mobius goes back to C
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We tried to actually make Mobius work, but she is not efficient, Mobile Fortress the Destroyer which is a F2P card can basically turn in to her while it's active is up. This being said, we can't take Mobius in a serious tone right now.
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Destroyer added to B- (Green Border)
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Just as mentioned before, the 5x multiplier from Destroyer feels better than Mobius overall.
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17-10-2018The Card Seals rating is now revealed again, please be aware that it will be updated soon with another format, I will add the missing banners in there.
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I gave access to Kaerfnomekop and Misty.exe to the file, they will be adding some missing stuff to the leader comments section. Yay outsourcing.
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Added a new column to the leader comments section where you will be able to find links to the team building threads of every leader and relevant videos as well.
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15-10-2018Created the Know Your memes page so new players, and players that are not in the Discord server can understand the cards on that tier.
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11-10-2018Added some Scholars and Donators that were missing in the Credits section.
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9-10-2018In this update the most noticeable changes are those from the bottom tier, trimming a lot of leaders based on their popularity and average damage.
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I also want to announce that starting from this week I might start working in data collection thanks to Furu#3839 who have some good ideas that can help to simplify our future evaluations and also make them more accurate and less biased.
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Also this week the feedback of the main topic changed because the chat in #meta-discussion drifted a lot from the main point. So some of the changes might be reverted next week. Konosuba cards are really strong and provide a lot of team building options.
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Right now I am a bit concerned from what is happening in the Standard (B) tier and because of that I plan to run some evaluation with origin of demons in some hard scenarios whenever they are available. I am a bit worried since we have been testing new content again and again but without taking in consideration the new members along some old leaders that might solve their drawbacks this way. Probably nobody cares, but I do.
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The project to revive /r/towerofsaviors is happening now so you might want to pay a visit and subscribe to that subreddit
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Placement changes:
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Darkness A- to A
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She is a Hulk, stats are too powerful and recovery is not as bad as originally expected.
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Aqua A+ (red border changed to green)
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The thing with Aqua is that her super strong kit is starting to have presence along with water mono teams, and acccess to the same utility that Atlantis have capitalized for a long time is letting her be way too dominant and popular. Also her meme value increased after everyone understood the meaning of the 87 joke on her numbers.
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Haza A- to A
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Having access to all beasts and removing the major drawbacks from that race have turned Haza in to a huge powerhouse for grinding or overcoming stages that punish for the lack of effective HP. Also now that people is able to run him as leader in the second part of the 8th seal he have regained popularity.
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Maya A- to B+
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This change was applied from A to B+ but somehow I forgot to set the placement correctly.
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Tang Sanzang from A- to B+
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Despite of the fact that some interesting members for him have started to show up, his base damage is still lacking, he is really in need of some good bonuses or boosters that allow him to stay relevant, otherwise the main difference with him will be based on how good your spinning skills are. As I mentioned before, he is in desperate need of another update, yet I don't believe he will drop down further from this unless madhead decides to increase the base mutliplier to 6x flat in the next batch of leaders.
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Suzuko B to B+
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The arrival of the Lizard Runner doesn't make much difference but this means that is possible that she will receive even more alternative members soon.
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Pontos B- to C+
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Bad RNG and unable to keep his max multiplier up is making Pontos stay way out of the picture, specially now that Aqua and Shiva were introduced with more reliable power and tools and without the need of a Power Release.
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Erebus B- to C+
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Dark mono is always good, but we can't deny the RNG problems. Even if you manage to fullfill the conditions the damage produced by the chunks of runes won't do much because the base multiplier is certainly low.
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King of Fighters from B- to C+
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A year have passed and power creep did a lot to them, the main 3 leaders have lost popularity and now are more common as members based on what they can do.
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Fallen Halos from C+ to C
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They were released somewhere in October or November of 2016, so yes 2 years without power release or amelioration is hurting them already along with a base multiplier of 3.5x
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Zhurong B+ > B
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I think that the biggest problem with Zhurong is her lack of identity and stats, I think she deserves a buff or something that could help to add more flexibility to her builds and increasing her effective HP.
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3-10-2018Fixed various typos and changed some icons that I didn't notice in the previous update.
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Added Konosuba collaboration cards to the tier list, for more information about them please read the Meta Analysis for version 16.1
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Added leader comments for Konosuba cards
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Replaced cards icons that used their costume rather than default artwork for clarity and to match the default like in the Leader comments section
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Placement changes:
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