GERRIE BRINK - AQUAFECTION
INTERVIEWER: Hello and welcome to the next episode of the Civitas Networks podcasts. We are joined here this morning by Gerrie Brink, the founder and CEO of Aquafection. Hello, Gerrie.
INTERVIEWEE: Hello Alistair.
INTERVIEWER: Thank you very much for joining me. For the listeners, we are testing out a new software called Cleanfeed, which is allowing us to record this podcast remotely. If it works, it could be a bit of a game-changer for us and allow us to speak to people nationally, internationally, all over. Anyway …
INTERVIEWEE: And see if it works across the SK belt [inaudible].
INTERVIEWER: That’s right, hey. As far as, even as far as the SK [inaudible]. All right, Gerrie, so before we get into your story, maybe you can just take a minute or two to describe to us exactly what your business is. What is the Aquafection?
INTERVIEWEE: Okay, in short, we basically focus on water efficiencies, helping large consumers to get their consumption down and then from there, obviously looking at options to augment the current demand. But we’ve got a few steps that we follow just to first get their consumption down and then look at the augmented sources of water. But the – our big goal, what we want to – what the business stands for and why we do what we do, is we want to try and help get South Africa, to surplus water by 2025. So why 2025? Is because it’s within a reachable horizon and a lot of the predictions over the past said that by 2025, South Africa is going to be an extreme water-scarce country. So we’re trying to see what we can do to turn that around and have surplus water by 2025.
INTERVIEWER: All right. Fantastic. I mean, so you’ve seen an opportunity in the future and you’re setting yourself up to be part of that opportunity by the time it arrives?
INTERVIEWEE: Yes, definitely. I always say that the bigger the trouble, the bigger the opportunities and in this country, we’re sitting with a hell of a lot of troubles and it’s just a big pile of trouble and you can just choose where you want to scratch and the opportunities will ooze out. So we just need to look for that opportunity, stop complaining and being negative and seeing all the trouble that’s going on around us as an opportunity to make a difference.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, maybe look for solutions and not just problems, hey?
INTERVIEWEE: Definitely, definitely.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, all right. So, Gerrie, if we can take – and we go back a few years, maybe you can tell me what your background is or what you were doing before Aquafection and then what your educational background is and I imagine you’re an engineer of sorts, if this is your business.
INTERVIEWEE: I’m a – I’m actually a Mining Engineer. I have studied Mining Engineering at the University of Pretoria and have started, worked about five years for Sasol Mining, did all my production underground and moved to BHP Billiton, did a lot of open cast production, did a lot of rehabilitation, long term planning and all the long term planning for BHP Billiton Energy Coal South Africa. So ten/twelve years in mining production, corporate, big corporate companies and half way before I started this business I – as part of my development at BHP Billiton, I did my MBA with the University of Stellenbosch and with their focus on leadership I actually realized that I’ve got a bunch of tools that are provided to me over my life that I need to utilise a bit better. And being in a corporate company, you would know that it’s difficult to change a system from the inside because a system is designed to stay the same, so to have control and processes to follow. So try and change a system from the inside, is practically impossible. So I saw some opportunities. My MBA gave me some hope that I’ve got the make-up to do it and halfway through my MBA I decided to start this business and ja, almost 180 degree change from mining and production to water conservation and more environmental stuff.
INTERVIEWER: Okay, you say it was a 180 degree change but you know your experience as an Engineer in companies like you’ve mentioned and I mean, that’s very valuable experience. I mean, you must have learnt different things; learnt how to do things and how to build things on the job, in those things, which you were able to transfer to Aquafection now.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, I think that’s actually the big value and it’s coming from mining and the industry that it is risky and changing continuously, gave me the tools to actually know and how to take on a challenge and try and make it work and think on your feet and being involved with the production side with that risk and stuff that can go wrong easily and if it goes wrong, it goes wrong majorly and to the other side being involved with rehabilitation of mined out areas and then the long term planning for the next 40 years in coal mining, gave me, actually a very nice set of tools to be able to focus on the details, the day to day stuff. But the effect that that has on – on the long term and how to plan for the stuff that you do now, what’s the effect going to be in the long run and how to pivot what you have now to actually get a better future. So the tools, I think, [inaudible] are much more effective in what I have to do because of my mining background. So on paper it looks 180 degrees apart but sometimes taking the learnings from one industry and applying to another one is what the new industry actually needed for a while to being turned on its head in the way they think.
INTERVIEWER: Okay, and then you know, when you were working in these big companies, I mean I know that mines are often very big water users, did you work in, you know, that part of the business? I know you get, what are they called, Hydro Engineers and stuff like that. I mean, were you involved in that at all? I mean, is that something which led you to this current venture?
INTERVIEWEE: In a way yes, because firstly, being a mining engineer you actually have to oversee the whole process, from the exploration right down to the long term planning and the beneficiation and the exports and everything. So you have an overview of the whole process and I actually started when I was still working underground at Sasol and seeing the level or the magnitude of the work and what you do to the earth and to – I mean, you’ve got a degree in how to beneficiate all the resources the earth can supply. So – and if it’s not managed properly the good that comes from that, it's got a bad side as well, if it’s not done properly and I saw all the bad stuff first-hand and the size of it is so big that it’s crazy. Then obviously open cast, same thing, there’re two sides to it. Obviously, the conservation to it, the damage you do but also managing the effect that that water has on your production underground and open cast. So you have de-water pits and underground areas to make sure you move water away from there where you have to work and that’s the one side to it. And then obviously, what do you do with that water because it’s already contaminated? The costs and processing of treating that water responsibly to put it back into the environment and then obviously be involved with rehabilitation, closing old mine areas and making sure that when it does rain you don't have seepage into old areas and decanting dirty water into clean water systems. All of that obviously, I had an influence to say, “Listen, but we need to do this on a – we need to change things on a macro level” and you cannot just change things on a macro level. You need to start with individuals, the decision makers, the small things. I always say you don’t try to change the world by just changing the big things. You need to change the small things, do a hundred things 1% better and make sure the small gears are turning and the big stuff will happen eventually by itself. So to focus on the big stuff is not going to change so we had to – I had to – you see, this is actually a big water consumer but I can’t just resign, start a business and then target the mining industry to solve the water issue. We need to start from another side and then eventually work towards that once we’re ready to actually hit that market as well.
INTERVIEWER: Okay, very interesting. So you’ve seen the full life cycle of the mine, you see where water is like a benefit and the uses of it and how it can be done right and wrong and then you went off and did your MBA and you obviously discovered a whole bunch of things on how to start a business and everything. So where was it when you decided to that the actual, I mean, I understand that you’ve witnessed it when you were working at BHP and Sasol and everything, and the importance of you know, correct or how did you say, that you correct water treatment. But when did you actually decide that that or how did you decide that that was the business which you were going to go and pursue?
INTERVIEWEE: Obviously doing – it came from the beginning knowing that obviously I have to build up some experience. You don’t just start a business when you get out of school. I mean you have to do your 10 000 hours and know what the industry is about or what the world is about and I always knew that I would like to do something on my own. But having, knowing where to focus on was always the issue and I made a lot of effort in my career in mining to try and cover all the bases and to learn as much as possible in a window of ten years. And then obviously, while I was busy with my MBA, the whole Cape Town water crisis, everything there was – there was a need – there was a gap and I saw that the approach to how people approach the water crisis, was not necessarily the right way or the most efficient way to do it, meaning that there is obviously, no matter how many guys get involved, they’re still not doing it optimised. So there was a gap to then say, “Listen, I’m going to stop this. I’m going to start a water company” and initially, we actually just focussed on domestic installations of rain water harvesting, small things you know, to get into the business and try to understand the ins and outs of water and how people think on an individual level, how water works but that was just a – to get into the industry and the plan was from the beginning to obviously escalate it to the larger consumers but you have to start small with a – like I said, you don’t just resign and the next day you arrive there on your white horse and change the world. It doesn’t work like that.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, you didn’t go knocking on BHP’s door on day one, hey?
INTERVIEWEE: No, no.
INTERVIEWER: You’ve got to - you [inaudible] need to learn your lessons with the smaller guys before you build up and go look for those big contracts.
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly and obviously having a pretty wide scope, not saying no to any business. I always say it was so tough in the beginning that we even put gutters on a thatched roof, just to keep the business alive. Needless to say that didn’t work [laughing]. It didn’t work very well but we did it and learnt from there. The nice thing, the learnings from that are not to change what you do; it’s just to actually eliminate what you don’t do. It’s just to narrow your scope and the list of the stuff that you say no, just becomes longer so that you can focus on the stuff that you actually want to do and you’re good at and not distracting you from your core vision and focus.
INTERVIEWER: Okay, very interesting. So when you actually decide to launch or start this business, what were some of the things which you needed to do? So you’ve – you know you’ve got your MBA, you’ve got an idea, how do you actually get this thing off the ground? I mean, are you talking to banks to get loans? Are you hiring first? Are you trying to make designs of something which could work for domestic users? Where do you actually kick off this business?
INTERVIEWEE: What – my whole approach is actually first to do some research, see what is in the market; know the history. What’s the issue? Is there actually a need for the service that I think I can provide? Is there a need for it and do I have the skills to do it? And what I’ve done is I’ve looked at guys that already [inaudible] domestic services. There was a company that’s been doing it for the last probably 20/30 years and I actually bought into them, bought the franchise, which helped create leads and so they were pushing leads to my side and got into the business and they had some stuff already, products that are working and they’ve got a name and some brand recognition and stuff, just to get into the game. And then obviously the nitty-gritty business stuff, I decided to do it right from the beginning you know, even though we didn’t have anything yet registered for VAT, sort out all that stuff. I had a guy that reported to me in my last job at BHP Billiton and I said, “Listen, come along. Let’s do it together for BEE purposes” because even though you don’t need all the BEE credentials before a 10 million turnover, I wanted to do it right and not get to a point where my company’s a 10 million turnover company and then I have to get rid of 50% or 51% shares, just to keep on doing business. So I had that all, everything in place and worked for, still worked for two/three months building up the leads, building up the – did some installations on my own over weekends, drove pretty far, I was still staying in Middelburg. Most of the work was all over Gauteng so just to get the ball rolling and no banks, no loans, no nothing. I had to dig into my own personal savings and when I resigned three months’ later, finally, I utilised my pension fund and everything to get everything off the ground.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, so you clearly had a lot of faith in what you were doing if you were willing to bootstrap to that extent. I mean I come from a partly financial background and you know, people who dip into that pension fund, is not something which a financial adviser would typically suggest.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, you don’t even have to be a financial adviser to advise against that. But ja, that’s where the alone journey actually started even family and friends that you wanted to borrow some money from, say, “Listen, the band’s going to make it.”
INTERVIEWER: It’s going to work. Have faith in me.
INTERVIEWEE: “We need some cash” and my father in law helped a bit but he had, I’ll never forget his facial expression that he’s, “What the hell are you doing? You’re leaving a very good job with a great future as an Engineer, one of the best companies in the world to do this and he just made it very clear that he doesn’t support and he thinks it’s a stupid idea. But he ended the conservation saying, “If somebody can make it work it’s probably you so.”
INTERVIEWER: Wow. I mean that’s very straightforward but I mean at the end of the day, gave you his trust and his faith, hey?
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly and at the end of the day it’s all you need just to get that motivation and say, okay but if he thinks that then there’s – obviously I can get it going and get some help somewhere else.
INTERVIEWER: I mean, it’s an amazing thing to have support and trust from anybody but I suppose family members like that as well. I mean when people believe in you it kind of gets you up and going as well. You know, if someone is giving you their hard-earned money, you don’t want to squander that. You want to make sure that they get it back and some.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, but there’re a few things that people say, well, or probably – or there’s a good chance that it will cost you your marriage. One of them is a MBA and one of them is starting your own business. So obviously combining those two, halfway through an MBA, starting your own business, increases the chances of actually doing some close relationships harm. But ja, we worked through it.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, I mean, I’ve also done my MBA [inaudible] and I know all about that so – and that as well. So it’s a very difficult year and then like you’ve said, if you’re starting something on top of that and all of a sudden your pockets are a little bit tighter, then you know, it makes for some difficult times, hey? And you need the support behind you to help you get through it.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, nee, exactly and I mean it was a module of three year MBA so obviously the second half of my MBA, I had to pay myself still, because it’s not being sponsored by a company anymore so there was that – there was a lot of pressure but I just said, “There is no plan b, we have to make this work because if somebody doesn’t do it, nobody is going to do it. We’ve got big troubles and if we don’t sort it out, we’re sitting with big problems on our hands in this country and globally, in fact.”
INTERVIEWER: Ja, you know there’s a very nice quote by Elon Musk. It goes something along the lines of, “If something is important enough, you should do it even if it’s very difficult.” Something along those lines.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, and I’m thinking he also said that in the beginning it’s difficult but sometimes you have to steal from Paul to pay Peter you know just to keep it going.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, so then in that initial year, you know, once you were full time at Aquafection, hey, are there any particular big wins and big losses which you can think of, you know, big things which really got you excited about the future of the business and big losses, which kind of scared you and which you needed to make or have a quick lesson about?
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, it’s – when you’re trying to build something like this and you know you need the resources on multiple levels, people and time and money and all the stuff you need and you know this thing has got potential but you need people on board, but you can’t pay them. So to sell that thing to tell people to risk what they have to join you and make this thing work that was quite a challenge. But the biggest difficulty was getting some of those guys on board, thinking that they had the same values and the same vision. But somewhere when the money doesn’t come in, they turn – they turn sour and so I had to get a lot of guys on board initially but also had to get rid of a lot of guys. I mean there were a lot of changes in the first year; changing from domestic to a mix of commercial and domestic. We actually got the first commercial client in the first year. So that was a big win. But also, we don’t – we didn’t have a name. So we had to do it at risk, almost as a proof of concept [inaudible] making no money, hoping this thing is going to work because this property fund has got a 180 millilitres[?] buildings in the country. So we need to – we need to make that work and it actually worked brilliantly and from there that – so they’ve become currently one of our biggest clients to date. So there was a – the most difficult part for me was the people component; getting guys on board. I’ve learnt a lot and saw that you need to get people, whether the company is successful or not, people need to be part of it or want to be part of it for the right reasons. Not to just have a job or they need to have the same vision but also, I always try not to employ someone that thinks the same way that I do because then one of us is redundant. I need somebody to challenge me with his background and his set of skills so that we can – with a minimum amount of people have the biggest impact and the biggest collection of possible solutions for the stuff that we face. I had a – one of my partners that is also now one of the Directors of the company, he helped a lot because he’s a – he was, at that time when it was the most difficult – company was about six months old. I need somebody – because you get to a point where you do the sales, you do the marketing, you do the installations. You do the after care, you do everything and if you’re focussing on an installation on a site, you drop, you can’t do the sales. So you’ve got these ups and downs. So I needed somebody, a team, to actually run constantly while I can secure new business and he was perfect for the job. I knew him from varsity days so we knew each other quite well and he was at the stage, he was retrenched from his previous job. So the timing was perfect. I asked him, “Listen, do you want to do this? Do you want to join me?” And since then we haven’t looked back and we grew – we grew quite substantially around here [inaudible], from there.
INTERVIEWER: So I mean, it’s one thing to bring on – I suppose like an executive level person who you’ve known for a long time, who you’ve built trust with and like you’ve said, you’ve known him since university. But how do you find like your – your sort of lower level employees like you said the people who are doing maybe labour jobs or admin jobs, but you still want to find people who buy into the company and buy into what you’re trying to do? How do you go about finding those people?
INTERVIEWEE: That is a – that’s probably one of the biggest challenges because when I left the mine, I said, I know with the country’s economy being in – you know, it’s difficult, was difficult for the last five years already, big companies retrenching people. So there’s a lot of skills out there and it sounds harsh but people that’s quite desperate because you don’t necessarily want a desperate guy just to put food on the table. You want the guy to buy into what you do and it’s difficult when a guy is – he will tell you that he’s seeing the vision and whatever and you provide the platform for them to grow and then at one point they just say, no, they don’t want to be part of this anymore. But every person that works for this company now has got actually a very special story about how we met and how they got involved with the company and it’s not like going to look for people. It’s being open and honest about what you do and how you do it and you will attract people to why you do things and that believes in the same things that you believe in, has the same values, you connect, if you can say it like that on a personal level and it goes from there. I mean one of the ladies that works for us, for the last two years already, we went to have an installation in Cape Town and we went to The Lounge at Lanseria Airport and the flight actually departed ten minutes early. So we missed the flight and this lady was working at the reception and we connected – she’s just such an amazing lady and we had a chat and she said, “Listen, but the next flight is only tomorrow morning” but she will open her house for us. We went and slept over at her house. She made her house open for us and she organised for transport the next morning and everything. She just – it was brilliant and then the next morning when she dropped us at the airport, I just – I told her, “Betty, you just nailed your interview.” So and then three months later we employed her. So all of the people working here have got a special story about how you share certain things but not necessarily knowing what we do, knowing what they do. But you connect on a certain level and people buy into the dream and they want to be part of it instead of putting out the ad and it says, “Listen, we need a secretary.” We need somebody that you can teach people skills but you cannot change their personalities or their values. So first, get somebody that’s on board because they want to be part of this and we can upskill them to what we need them to do.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, I mean I think that’s an amazing way to think of it, I mean you start building and securing your company culture from the very, very beginning.
INTERVIEWEE: Yes.
INTERVIEWER: And if you pay attention to it, then you get the company which you want or you get the company culture that you want.
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly and you get people that take ownership for the dream and for the difference, they become the company. They - I mean you just give – I always say my – I don’t, I’m not here to manage people, I’m here to provide you the platform so that you can be the best version of yourself to do what you need to do and if you do that I’m just there to provide you the guideline and the lines to stay within and provide you with the resources to do what you can do.
INTERVIEWER: That’s great, a very forward thinking way to operate a business.
INTERVIEWEE: And in contrast, very much in contrast to big companies, especially mining companies, it’s still very old school and hierarchy is quite important so.
INTERVIEWER: So, Gerrie, if we move on to the next step, so now you’ve, you know you’ve had a good first year, you’ve got your big I don’t know if it was enterprise clients but your first big commercial sized client, I guess you’re thinking this business could actually work. What did you do in - beyond your first year to kind of replicate the sales, to replicate some of the big wins that you’d had and then I suppose expanding becomes an important thing like how did you manage expansion which I mean we’ve spoken about it a lot about it already but how ...?
INTERVIEWEE: Again, it’s almost the same when people ask me who’re my competitors?
INTERVIEWER: So here we lose Gerrie for a moment but we get him back and move straight back into it.
INTERVIEWEE: It sounds cliché, word of mouth and that’s the best marketing but if you do the right things for the right reasons and you’re able to do it long enough, people will buy in to what you do and it’s not for me making money, is an outcome, it’s a resource to actually apply again to build on what we need to do to make a difference in this country. And once people start seeing that and the benefit you get on a much bigger scale and the fact that it makes financial sense. So there’s nowhere that you can pitch it to anybody that it doesn’t - the environmental guys, the engineering guys, the asset managers, property managing guys, it just makes sense to everyone, the whole process that we follow. So that everybody’s actually aligned and there’s a hell of a big financial saving or benefit to that as well but we think in kilolitres. When you need to save water not money. If you save water you will save money. If you ask people, anyone, how much water do you use at home, at work whatever, they normally answer you in rand values. We use about R400 worth of water. I said that’s not the question, how much water do you use not how much do you pay for water because obviously water prices differ and once you start getting people to think in volumes of what they use and not in rand value, because in South Africa, water has been available and almost free as long as you can remember. It’s never been an issue, the cost or the availability and that’s why R200, R1000, R2000 we don’t care if you compare what your water component for a commercial building is to compare to the electricity component and the rates, the taxes and rent. Water is minute but if add it all together and you can pitch it to a commercial client and say, “Listen, this is what we can achieve, at one building, you’ve got 180 mil[?], this is the number of kilolitres you can save and there’s obviously a relating monetary component to that as well and that’s huge. And that’s what our whole approach – I’ll tell you about the – a little bit later, the way forward about the whole Surpluswater2025 initiative and the marketing component. The nice thing about - when it works, when it saves you money, it creates marketing. I tell people when you put up a rainwater harvesting tank at your offices or your shopping centre or whatever, put it right in front of the building and market it and say, “This is what we’ve done to make a difference” and how the whole thing pans out, you obviously, you have an asset or a landlord, the property funds and the growth points, Emile, Atterbury[?] it’s all those guys and then you’ve got guys that manage their properties for them, property management companies like Proell[?] and Ellis[?] and Accelerate[?] all those guys and then you’ve got the tenants in a building. Then you’ve got service providers to those buildings as well. Now our approach, you cannot do any water management or efficiencies without proper monitoring. So the first step is to actually install an electronic logging device on your main incoming line. That already gives you an understanding of the building. It provides tools for the property management company to do their work better. You see the gaps where you can reduce consumption. Obviously, the landlord then have a benefit, if they reduce the actual demand of a building, the tenants have the benefit because they pay less for water and all that stuff and the big nice positive about it, is you save water and we all contribute towards making a difference. And then obviously property owner, they’ve got a property management company but that property management company work for other landlords and property owners as well. So you’ve got this one office building of one owner but it’s managed by the same company for another owner. So you get into different buildings, different sites with different tenants and the whole thing just pans out naturally and that’s why I don’t actually want to market too aggressively because if – if it takes off, we don’t have the resources to actually service the need and then you drop the ball. Then you’ve – everything you’ve worked - actually if you can’t service – service the need. We don’t market and tell people how big their need actually is because they don’t know. People don’t know what – how dire the water situation is in the country and once you start telling them, you see the colour of their faces change and they start panicking and then they ask what do we ...?
INTERVIEWER: Then you know that you’ve got them.
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly, then the next question is but what can we do about it?
INTERVIEWER: Yes.
INTERVIEWEE: So here’s the stuff that you can do about it and you don’t necessarily even have to use me but there’s something you have to do. Here’re some things that you can do, here’re companies that can help you to do it and we’re also one of those companies that can help you but what you have to do is just make a decision and do something.
INTERVIEWER: Very interesting. Gerrie, if we can take a look at your business, I mean before we started this chat, we spoke a little bit about some of the people who are working with you? So I know that you’ve got some family members who are on your staff and I suppose partnering with you. Can you - could you tell us a little bit about what it’s like working with, you know, close relationships like that, family people and how you manage those personalities to make sure that your business keeps running positively in the way that you want to and that the culture keeps on you know, is a positive culture and keeps on building the way you need it to?
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, it is, it’s probably one of the biggest challenges involving people that you do know like family and friends but it’s also one of the biggest rewards if you, if you do it correctly. Because like I said earlier, with employees and stuff, you need to have people with the same set of values as you are and obviously if you know people for a while, being friends with them for 15 plus years, it means that there’s already alignment in values. But because - and with family what we normally do wrong with family, is we think we know each other because we’re family and I think that’s the biggest mistake people make is they think they know one another because they are family. I think because you are family, you know people even less than because you slot into a certain position where you are in the family, when you get together you’re a certain person at a family gathering and none of those people know how you operate in the real world; where you are at work or but when you get together you slot into your position of the family and everything’s happy and weekend’s over and everybody goes back. But nobody sees you when you’re operating in the zone, if you can call it that. The people that I’ve involved, family-wise in my company, is my father and my older brother, which already makes it difficult because it’s your older brother and your dad.
INTERVIEWER: So meant to be the other way round right? So they are meant to be the seniors?
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly and funny thing is they’re both reverends, so they’re preachers and I know they had a big network and we need to – it’s changing people’s mindset about how you approach water and efficiencies, is almost like spreading the gospel. So they were set up with their networks to do it properly and me and my older brother have got a very special friend relationship and we’re pretty open with one another and I knew I need guys that’s actually, that’s got the tools and the same values and the same vision but there’s a lot of them out there but they’re bloody expensive. My brother for instance, he’s a – he’s got five degrees he’s clever he’s got a Doctor’s Degree and all that stuff. But he was - about four years ago, he was diagnosed with early onset Parkinson’s and then he was boarded so he sat at home with all the skills and all this passion and nowhere to apply it. And I told him, “Listen, here’s an opportunity for you to actually keep on spreading or living out your passion without the stresses.” And I can actually because he’s got a pension income, he can just do it to keep him busy and to actually give him a purpose so and that’s again, why the people involved in this company, all of them has got a special story of how they got involved, not to help people out but this is, there’re some things that comes along your way, over your path, that you can use it or you can ignore it. And here’s an opportunity with somebody with somebody with a hell of a lot of resources, mentally and with people skills that I can apply without breaking the bank or if I have to get somebody of his equivalent somewhere else, I’m not going to be able to afford it. So here I can pivot my company with skills, without costing me a lot of money. Ja, and his wife is a psychologist and also perfect, we’re setting up a whole new training leg of the business to create the awareness because obviously, if people are aware of their needs, they will obviously come to you and ask for assistance to sort that out. So that’s how she got involved. So she’s head of the whole training and skills development side, side of things, so in a way, it’s a different company. I’ve registered a different company for the skills side of it and the training and in the bigger scheme of things, with the whole BEE and skills development being part of - a lot of - 25% of your BEE scorecard, there’s a huge gap for skills development as well and there’s money available. So we can help companies spend their money on skills development and up-skilling their people in knowing what to do with water, actually have a financial benefit with them. So this is spending your skills development and getting the benefit for more effective employees with regards to efficiencies. On the previous point of family, I didn’t actually answer that question properly but the one thing that you have to do when you do business with people, with family and friends is to be honest. Don’t wait for stuff - assume that they know you so well that they oversee it or that communication is, just don’t assume that because you think he knows you, he thinks the - he knows the way you think. You have to be open and honest and before stuff escalates, stop it right there and say, “Listen, I’m not happy with this, how it works, these are the boundaries, this is what, this is what” and that’s also the only way where you can work together but still have a healthy relationship outside of work, if you’re honest and open to what you want and what your vision is.
INTERVIEWER: And then like we were saying and your vision for the future and where you see your growth heading and then you also mentioned a moment ago, your vision 2025.
INTERVIEWEE: Yes, ja, the water situation in our country and globally is huge, I mean we – if you look at the water we have on the planet is fixed. We can’t create water, we cannot destroy it. All we can do is manage it properly. If we cannot build bigger dams in Gauteng or in the country and think we’re going to sort out the water issue because we still get the same amount of rain or less than in the past. So the supply, water supply is fixed. We cannot change that. Pretoria, Tshwane grows at a rate of 10 000 people per month, with the same supply for the next ten years. The next bump in supply is actually in 2030 when a new Lesotho Project comes online. So for the next ten/eleven years, in Gauteng, we’ve - the exact same supply with substantial growth in Joburg and Pretoria. So if you look at the supply line that’s a fixed flat line but the demand line is actually growing exponentially. We are currently, I think the last time where supply and demand were on par, was 2013. Now, this year 2019, in Gauteng, we are using 15% more than can be supplied by rainwater.
INTERVIEWER: So we’re already using 15% more than what can be supplied. So obviously it’s like paying a credit card with a credit card. We’re drawing empty dams that we don’t have and if we don’t get rain we, it’s impossible to keep it up. So the only thing we can do, is not build bigger dams, we don’t have the luxury like Cape Town to have the option of desalination plants, how costly and ineffective that is but we don’t have that option. So we have to – we cannot change the supply works [inaudible]. All we can do is reduce the demand and that’s where we are registered, it’s just a normal #Surpluswater2025. But it’s a logo, I’ve registered the logo and the idea behind it is actually if you monitor your consumption, if you know your history, your data, you say, used 100 kilolitres per day, your company. If you install electronic locking device, you start seeing the patterns of your consumption. You see if there’s leaks, you see if there’s toilets getting stuck [inaudible] and you can actually sort it out within 24 hours, not waiting for a council bill to see listen, we’ve got a high consumption, so we probably have a leak or 60 days or 90 days cause there’re estimate readings in between there as well. You can fix it almost in real time, bringing or just having that monitoring, the awareness already makes about a 10 or 20% difference in your consumption. So if you used 100 kilolitres a day ...
INTERVIEWER: Significant [inaudible].
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly - that’s just awareness, knowing what’s going on. You know your history, you’ve used100 kilolitres, you installed a locking device. Your awareness [inaudible] the tools your maintenance guy has actually something to work on and to see what the effect is of what they did and that ten, if you dropped it by ten, ten kilolitres, your company, that’s your contribution towards getting to Surpluswater2025. So if everybody knows their inefficiencies and if they install electronic water metres and they can drop just from the awareness, drop their consumption by 20%, we’re already making up that 15% that we’re using more than what we can supply now. Then the next step is efficiency devices. We got a patented toilet ...
INTERVIEWER: Sorry, at this time we lost Gerrie to loadshedding. Fortunately, he gave us a call back straightaway on his phone. Hi Gerrie, sorry, are you back?
INTERVIEWEE: Yes, ja, I’m doing it with my phone now. So ja that’s just the challenges of, one of the challenges of this beautiful country.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, I mean if you - you could have gone either way, you could have gone water conservation or energy conservation.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, the thing is with energy there’re so many guys in that industry because energy is easy to sort out because you can put up solar panels and you know the sun is going shine. But the water is a bit intimidating because you don’t see it, it’s like a ghost, you don’t see it and that’s why the starting point is the monitoring. Sure, you start understanding that.
INTERVIEWER: So Gerrie, where we lost you, was you were just about to talk about a toilet patent which you had.
INTERVIEWEE: Yes, ja, that’s - part of the whole process with the domestic clients, we’ve developed a toilet flushing mechanism that actually can – in a domestic sense, it says at least 50% of your toilet water because it’s interrupt the flush. You don’t need more than, you hold down the handle or the button as long as you need it, so you’ve got the volumes. And in commercial buildings, if you’ve got an old building with a twenty seven litre cistern, every time you flush the toilet it’s twenty seven litres down the drain. With our mechanism installed there, we saved one of the clients 87% just by changing the flushing mechanism of the toilets because I did - my MBA Thesis was on the toilet consumption in commercial buildings in South Africa, so ...
INTERVIEWER: Okay, so you’re an expert.
INTERVIEWEE: So we’ve got the data and that’s the nice thing if you can actually see on the data when there’s a toilet getting stuck. A toilet getting stuck 100/200 litres an hour, overnight, over a weekend, that’s you know, it’s 20 000 litres down the drain with just one toilet running. So that’s part of the easy stuff to actually sort out companies, or a business or a building’s efficiency and that’s getting back to the Surpluswater20/25. Once you monitor that, if you - the awareness is the first step or the knowing and then the efficiency devices you can actually drop a building’s consumption by 80% without spending a hell of a lot of money.
INTERVIEWER: That’s amazing, I mean that is an amount which any frugal [inaudible] business should be interested in that.
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly, now this whole Surpluswater2025 is if you started with your baseline of 100 kilolitres, you did all these steps and you got down to twenty, that eighty that you’re saving is your contribution towards Surplaswater2025 and because we’re monitoring it, we know what the baseline is and we monitor it on a continuous basis, to know month by month, day by day, are you still sustainable on your lower consumption? Now if you’ve got one building saving eighty, you’ve got a hundred buildings, each saving eighty, so you as a company are contributing say 800 000. We’re getting to a point now where just our company are saving more than a million litres per day and that’s trackable. That’s traceable and then obviously you’ve got the guys producing. We gave our patent product to Duck and Plastics that makes the toilet flushing mechanisms anyway. So they’re running with it, they’re part of the Surpluswater2025 and the whole idea with it, it’s not just benefitting one company. A big business, a property fund - don’t necessarily want to put my company’s name on their door and say, “Aquafection helped us to conserve water.” They want to say we are part of the Surpluswater2025 initiative and this is what we’re contributing. This is what we’re doing. The marketing side of it is huge. You know this - a few years ago your environmental component of your annual report, was one page, now it’s a whole section. It’s know it’s almost to a point where you cannot afford not to do it. There’s the nice touchy, feely stuff, the effect of it that if we don’t do it, we’re going be in trouble. But the nice thing is, there’s a huge financial benefit to it and because we’ve got the approach of first monitoring and then reducing and then on the reduced consumption, we design backup systems and alternative sources, which means the system you have to install for a two day or a week backup, is 80% smaller than it used to be, which means the capital side for a client to pay for, is 80% less for the same outcome. So you’re saving money, you’ve got your backup, you’ve got your water and doing it in that sequence also means that your payback on the capital spend is ridiculously small, it’s like 12 months. The big system is not even two years and meaning then that you’ve lowered your consumption and you’re saving a hell of a lot of money.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, I mean, like you keep on saying, I mean you’re -become part of this incredibly important solution.
INTERVIEWEE: Exactly and that’s why it’s also a hash tag, so even people on - at home, when they take a picture or something, they can say #Surpluswater2025. But that’s also why I registered as a trademark, so the big companies can say we’re part of this initiative and it’s a trademark and we can use the logos and there’s some brand recognition and some, you know try and - the whole vision and idea and hope, is to get a movement going and the bigger the movement, the more benefit my company will have. But the more benefit a lot of companies will have and in the long run the country will benefit by it. Hugely.
INTERVIEWER: Ja fantastic. Gerrie, I think that’s a very admirable movement you’re - and initiative you’re trying to develop here. Gerrie, I think that’s about as much time as we have for today. We’ve run over usual length. It’s been extremely interesting chatting to you today. So thanks very much for your time. Unfortunately we have, we’ve lost you a couple of times. We can put that down to loadshedding and but we’ve got you back. I think we’ve got all the important insights that we could possibly get and we’re looking forward to having you in our own network, to be speaking with our members and hopefully learning from our members as well.
INTERVIEWEE: Ja, cool stuff and thanks Alistair and thanks for making contact and setting up the platform to learn from other guys also trying to make an impact.
INTERVIEWER: Ja, of course. It’s our pleasure. Gerrie, thanks very much.
INTERVIEWEE: Thanks, Alistair.
INTERVIEWER: Goodbye.
INTERVIEWEE: Cheers.
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