News
 

• Disneyland announced the re-theming of Frontierland’s Hungry Bear Restaurant to Hungry Bear Barbecue Jamboree, and then:

• Installed a Big Al statue near Grizzly River Run
• Posted to Twitter a Country Bear Hoedown with the D23 hashtag #Horizons:
  
• Which led to this question from our friend Andrew: Might Disneyland revisit the Country Bears franchise? The most logical idea is a re-theme of Grizzly River Run and resurrect the Country Bear 500 idea.

• Len says: I mean, it’s possible they’re just over-hyping a D23 panel like “40 years of costuming” or whatever.
• Jim and Jim, what do you think?
  

• Universal Orlando’s parent company, Comcast, had its quarterly earnings call last week, and it was … not great.

• Revenue was down as compared to last year, which they attribute to the following things:

• 2/3rds of the revenue drop due to lower attendance, primarily because of:

• Opening of Super Nintendo World in USH the previous year
• A post-COVID “pull” of visits in 2022 and 2023, when some of those visits would’ve otherwise happened in 2024.
• Cruises as an alternative
• A strong dollar makes international visits more expensive, so we get less of them
• Folks are waiting until 2025 for Epic Universe to open
• Mike Cavanagh (President, Comcast): THESE TRENDS WILL CONTINUE UNTIL EPIC OPENS
• They specifically say that theme park revenue is impacted by the fact that they haven’t opened a major new attraction in Orlando since VelociCoaster in 2021.

• I know we keep saying on this show that new rides drive attendance. It is the fundamental truth of theme park operations.

• In speaking with financial analysis after that call, and with folks in the UOR community I think we’d all consider “experts”, there are some rumblings - things I would classify as rumors, yet still concerning:

• My own conversations with people seem to indicate that Universal was hoping to open Epic in the first 3-ish months of 2025. Then that slipped to “summer” 2025.
• And now I’m hearing these things:

• We don’t have a solid opening date yet.
• At least one major land won’t be complete until fall 2025
• Universal’s considering a “phased opening” where they open most, but not all of the park, to paying guests.

• There are, as you can imagine, many, many risky things here for Universal:

• They pretty much have to have a solid opening MONTH no later than Thanksgiving.
• Families start talking about vacation ideas for 2025 when they get together for the holidays, and that HAS TO BE a part of the conversation. Because if you get everyone excited for something else, and you start researching and budgeting that, it’s going to be hard to switch.
• They have to have a solid opening DAY by the first week of January, 2025. That’s when most people will go back to work and put in their vacation requests for the year.
• It will be exceptionally challenging to convince people to pay full-price for a park that isn’t completely open

• Especially if they’re also planning to prioritize admission to Epic by how much you spend on hotels and tickets.
• A lot of families will just push that visit into 2026, when everything is running.
• Not for nothing, Disney and the rest of Central Florida is really counting on an attendance boost from Epic.

• Then there’s ride capacity.

• On July 24, Disney World launched the latest version of its Lightning Lane ride reservation system, Lightning Lane Multi-Pass.

• Jim, with all respect to her majesty Brittney Spears and the B Army, I think it’s safe to say that Brit-Brit’s 55-hour Las Vegas marriage to Jason Alexander went better than this.

• I’m not even sure I can call these ‘issues’ or ‘problems’, because I don’t know if this is a case of bad technology, bad planning, or what. Like, I can’t really explain what we’re seeing.
• Some LLMP attractions are completely sold out for the next week or more.
• Some ILL attractions like 7DMT immediately sold out 6 days in advance.

• It’s possible that the number of seats allocated per hour for LL didn’t change with this release.
• That would be something the Industrial Engineers had to make some kind of assumption on for the purposes of modeling. And an assumption of “Each day’s future demand is going to be the same as the typical current day demand” is a reasonable assumption.
• But it discounts the possibility that more people will use G+ once they know they can book X days in advance, which would increase demand.
• It’s also possible that whatever amount of ride capacity was allocated to off-site and same-day availability, was too high relative to future demand.

• It was possible to have three LLMPs at EPCOT, for (say) Remy, Mission: Space, and Living with the Land, all for the exact same one-hour return window (e.g., 10 am to 11 am)

• You can do this by modifying existing return times, so might not be the default (or intended) behavior. But you can do it.
• It’s not physically possible to accomplish those three rides in an hour.
• The “Grace Period” for showing up late for your return time seems to be 60 minutes, so sure, if you know that it’s fine.
• I’d heard the default overlap was 15 minutes.
• I cannot imagine what the Guest Experience team’s days are like now.

Surveys

Listener Emails

Renee asks for Jim and Jim:

I’m really surprised that Rogers: The Musical didn’t have a longer run or reopen at some point. As far as I know, the theatre isn’t being used for anything since the show ended last August? I never got to see it in person and hope it comes back again somewhere at some point. What’s next for DCA’s Hyperion Theatre?

From John Forrest, for Jim and Jim:

With Inside Out 2 taking over the top spot for animated films of all time, do we get the Wonders of Life Pavilion back in some way?

Len research:

Our friend Tim Wallaert, who was at the now-famous recreation of the Maelstrom ride, wrote in with more of the backstory:

I couldn't help but break out laughing at the memory of the 2014 WDW Today Reunion re-enactment of the Maelstrom ride.  The event was called “Maelstrom in a Minute”, and the idea was to recreate the entire Norway pavilion experience in 60 seconds.

Len says: Oh god, this is all coming back to me now. It was “Maelstrom in a Minute.”

Tim continues: Here’s the backstory on how you got your ski jumper...

I had been planning the trip for the family as a surprise Christmas gift, and needed a way to do the “big reveal” Since my daughter Sarah was obsessed with Twitter at the time, I asked Len to tweet at Sarah that he was looking for a ski jumper.  Which, as soon as she saw it on her feed, was like "Dad, why is Len Testa tweeting at me?!?!?".  At which point I revealed to Sarah and her three brothers that we were headed to Disney.

Len says: We told Sarah to bring something that looked like a ski-jumper unitard. She showed up in penguin-themed onesies pajamas, which was COMPLETELY ON THEME. For goggles we used a snorkel mask.

Tim continues:

It appears that Disney's lawyers have not yet the following link on YouTube Maelstrom in a Minute (https://youtu.be/mRACrU43v4w?si=6ViCkbNg_gx_dNM3) where you can still watch Len's directing debut in all of its glory (I like to think this was the formative years for a young Hank Lonely).  The "whoosh" of the ski jumper still holds up.

Fast forward seven or so years from that event and that ski jumper (and former watercraft cast member) is interviewing Jim for her senior thesis on Internationalization of Disney Parks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRACrU43v4w&authuser=0

From our friend Dan Bidenstein, about the new Country Bear Jamboree show:

CBJ was something I went to see on every visit. In my opinion, the old show was about the Country Bears singing songs, and the new show seems to be about songs sung by Country Bears. The emphasis now is on the songs, not the Bears.

I also wanna mention that the song lyrics to “Try Everything” sound like an anthem for drinking around the world at EPCOT.

Len says: I wrote back to Dan saying “I thought I was smart and then you drop this on me at 8 am.”

From Michael Lee of Dublin, Ohio:

Research/Patents (use query "disney enterprises".as AND "theme park".ab)

Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster feature piece
for July 29th “Disney Dish”

JIM H (Intro):

It was 25 years ago today that -- July 29, 1999 – that there was an invitation-only party at Disney’s Hollywood Studios. Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster starring Aerosmith would be opening to the public the next morning (July 30, 1999).

But tonight (i.e., July 29th), a select few would get the chance to avail themselves to an all-you-can-eat buffet – not to mention an open bar …

Side note: Given that these same people would then be among the first to actually experience the new thrill ride at the Park that – at this time, anyway – is still know as Disney-MGM … Given that – when you ride Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster – you go from 0 to 57 MPH in 2.8 seconds. You also experience three inversions while pulling 5 Gs.

Taking all that into account, I have to say … I don’t know if it was such a good idea to have an all-you-can-eat buffet & an open bar at an event like this.

JIM S: (Interjects) But this was a media event, Hill. And as someone who has the word “media” as part of the name of his company, you know what goes on at a Disney-run media event. The company wants you to have a good time at the opening of a new attraction. Which is why they offer you all sorts of free food & drink, not to mention handing a bag full of swag as you exit this party.

And this party – the one on July 29th – was especially special. Given that it featured a live performance by Aerosmith itself in the courtyard right outside of the entrance of Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster. Which – of course – was capped off by a fireworks display that was then shot off of the roof of the Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster show building.

LEN: I wasn’t at this party. But I was at Walt Disney World when this media event was happening. In fact, I was staying at the Boardwalk at the concierge level (I want to say that I was there for some sort of work-related conference. This was back when I was still working for American Express). And I wound up staying in the room right across the hall from where Steven Tyler was staying.

Longtime Aerosmith fan. Still behaved myself. Which is more than I can say about the kids of the Areosmith band members. Who really liked running up & down the hallway right outside my room.

So as the guy who rode herd on the construction of Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster, what’s it like to finally reach this point? To it now being time to hold the media event for the ride you just spent the past five years pulling up out of the ground?

JIM S: Well, Mr. Hill was just talking about that opening night party and its all-you-can-eat buffet & open bar. And – of course – the people who attend this media event are going to need places where they can sit down and eat their food & drink their drinks.

So the day of this media event, the people who set up all of these tables & chair are asking “Can we set up in this corner of the courtyard?” And we then have to tell them “No” because the concrete hasn’t actually dried yet. That’s how close we cut it with the construction of Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster.

LEN: But to get to see Aerosmith perform live in a tiny little venue like that, that must have been cool.

JIM S: Interesting story about that. You have to understand that – because this was an attraction that celebrated Rock ‘n’ Roll music, it already had the very best sound system on property. We spent hours making sure that – once you came through that entry arch – all of the music that Guests heard in the area was clean & crisp & sharp.

But because Aerosmith was now going to perform live in this same space … Well, that now meant that all sorts of speakers & cables & generators then had to be hauled in and set up just to support this live concert. Which is why – on the day of the opening party – I came into work and found a Semi loaded with concert gear parked in my usual spot.

JIM H: And I’d imagine that all of that cabling & wiring for the speakers & those generators had to go somewhere. So did they run it through the planters & the gardens in the courtyard at Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster?

JIM S: They did. But here’s the interesting aspect of Disney doing a media event. Sure your gardens & planters get stomped & flattened at a moment like that. But then the people who are running this media event can get on the phone to Horticulture and say “We need a whole bunch of pretty new plants now. Send them over immediately.” And that same day, these previously trampled planters get replanted and now look gorgeous.

LEN: That sounds expensive.

JIM S: It is. Or was. But you have to remember that – two months earlier (in Late May of 1999) – Universal’s Islands of Adventure had opened just down the street. And Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster was one of the main ways that Walt Disney World was responding to what Universal had just opened. So it was crucial that the media event for this new thrill ride at Disney’s Hollywood Studios go off without a hitch. That the ride look great right from the get-go.

And if that meant replanting all of the flowers around the courtyard just before that night’s party, that’s what you did. No matter what it eventually cost the Company.

In the end, all that mattered here was that the members of the press who were attending that night’s party came away with amazing photographs of this attraction & that night’s concert. Because those were the images that were going to wind up in newspapers & magazines in the days & weeks that followed. And it was those images – and the hopefully positive coverage – that would then convince people that “Hey, we need to get back down to Walt Disney World and check out this new Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster ride.”

JIM H: And when we were pre-gaming today’s feature segment, you were talking about how you went from building this attraction to then selling this attraction.

JIM S: Again, it was really important to the Walt Disney World Resort that the launch of this enclosed, launched coaster go well. Which is why – the morning after this party – I was met at my apartment in Orlando by a media handler at 4 a.m. I was handed a t-shirt – that I think said “Rock n Roller Coaster now open” – and then driven back to Disney’s Hollywood Studios. Where – starting at 6 a.m. – I began sitting down with DJs who were doing live remotes from this theme park.

LEN: I remember seeing this set-up. They had tables for radio stations set up along the length of Sunset Boulevard. There must have been three or four dozen of these things.

JIM S: And I sat down and talked with every single one of them. My media handler kept me on schedule. I went on the air with each of these radio stations and then made sure to hit all of the talking points that Disney’s PR team had given me. Then – after five minutes or so – my media handler would gesture that it was time to move on to the next radio station. I’d then wrap up that interview and move on to the next table.

JIM H: So if you started at 6 a.m., these must have been mostly for radio stations on the East Coast. Did you do any press for West Coast outlets for Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster.

JIM S: Funny you should say that. My wife Tracey saw me – this was probably on KABC, the ABC flagship station for the LA market – early that morning out in Southern California. I was on live television. And to hear her talk, I’d obviously had way too much coffee by that time. I was very enthusiastic about Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster.

LEN: Jeese. And you had to do this at least twice, right?

JIM S: Yes. That’s one aspect of the Walt Disney World Resort that a lot of stateside Disney fans don’t seem to appreciate or understand. That this Resort also relies heavily on Guests who come to Florida from overseas. In fact, back then, because these people didn’t just buy theme park admissions & book hotel rooms but bought whole vacation packages, they were a client base that the Company put a serious amount of time & effort into courting.

Which is why – just a few days after I’d worked with Disney’s PR team on the domestic launch of Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster starring Aerosmith – here I was, doing the exact same thing again. Walking from table to table to sit down with DJs and share my 5 talking points. Only this time, I was talking with radio stations that were based in the UK.

JIM H: And the worst part of this is … You’re doing all of this PR stuff while you’re still working on Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster, right?

JIM S: Well, I’m proud to say that – when it came to this thrill ride for Disney’s Hollywood Studios – we’d met our delivery date. We’d delivered this attraction on time and under budget. But even though the ride was now officially open didn’t mean that this job was actually over. We still had a punch list of things that still needed to be done.

LEN: But if Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster was now open, how are you then addressing things that still need to be done on the ride?

JIM S: That’s what Third Shift is for, Len. We’d go back into this attraction after Disney’s Hollywood Studios had closed for the day and then do what we had to.

JIM H: You had to do this … And – in the last six months or so of construction – find ways to accommodate FastPass.

JIM S: Well, everywhere else at Walt Disney World, they were going to have to figure out how they were going to set up FastPass stations (which cost a million dollars each to set up, by the way) near already up-and-running rides, shows & attractions. Because we were still under construction, we could then lay down the necessary conduit for FastPass in advance. But even then, they weren’t entirely sure what they’d need. We ask the FastPass team “How much conduit do we actually need for this thing?” And they’d say “Lots.’

LEN: I have to say that – when we were working on the Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster episode of “Disney Unpacked” – it was cool to get to experience this ride with you and hear all your stories about how this attraction actually came together. Like how that autographed poster of Aerosmith that Guests see in the exit of the gift shop at this ride wasn’t put up ‘til a year after this attraction first opened. Largely because it took that long to catch up with all of the Aerosmith band members and then get them to sign that poster.

JIM S: Well, Aerosmith is a rock band after all. And as soon as they took part in the opening night concert, the guys then went off on a worldwide tour. And we then had to wait for them to finish that tour before we could then collect all of their signatures.

JIM H: And speaking of the gift shop at Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster … When we walked through there, you seemed stunned that some of the props that you put into place in that store 25 years ago were … Well, are in the same exact places that you placed them back in 1999.

JIM S: Again, that was one of those things on my punch list for this project. Get the props properly placed inside of the gift shop. Just never expected to see that stuff still where I originally placed it so long ago.

LEN: One quick question before we close here: Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster came back online earlier this month after being down for six months. Given that this thrill ride is now 25 years old, what does a rehab for a coaster that’s that age typically entail.

JIM S: Well, I retired from Walt Disney Imagineering more than two years ago now. So I don’t have any specific inside information on what was done on Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster this time around. That said, when you have a coaster that’s this age and you’ve got just six months to give this thing some TLC, this is what you do. SHULL SHARES.

LEN: Fascinating. Thanks for coming on the show. By the way, if you want to learn even more about “Rock ‘n’ Roller Coaster starring Aerosmith,” we did a whole show about the development of this thrill ride over on “Disney Unpacked.” I want to say that was Episode Six of Season One of our new video series for Patreon.