Objective Personality System Notes
Complete Attempt v.1
By Daniel Jennings
Table of Contents
Section | Page | Length of Section |
Acknowledgements | 3 | 1 |
Chapter 1 - Saviours and Demons | 4 | 6 |
Chapter 2 - Coins and Four Function Models | 10 | 3 |
Chapter 3 - Coin 1 - O/DD vs D/OO - Single Observer vs Single Decider | 13 | 4 |
Chapter 4 - Introversion and Extroversion | 17 | 3 |
Chapter 5 - Di vs De - IxxPs vs ExxJs | 20 | 7 |
Chapter 6 - Oi vs Oe - IxxJs vs ExxPs | 27 | 4 |
Chapters 7-8 - F vs T, and the Functions Fi, Te, Ti and Fe | 31 | 7 |
Chapters 9-10 - S vs N, and the functions Si, Ne, Ni and Se | 38 | 6 |
Chapter 11 - Animals 1 - Blast and Consume | 44 | 3 |
Chapter 12 - Animals 2 - Jumpers, Play and Sleep | 47 | 4 |
Chapter 13 - Letter and Animal Combinations | 51 | 6 |
Chapter 14 - Animal Stacks, Info and Energy Dominance | 57 | 11 |
Chapter 15 - Function Modalities, M-S, M-De | 68 | 8 |
Chapter 16 - Anecdotes and Stereotypes | 76 | 9 |
Chapter 17 - Typing someone’s personality | 85 | 2 |
Chapter 18 - Criticisms of the system | 87 | 2 |
Chapter 19 - Other Models | 89 | 4 |
Chapter 20 - Hero’s Journey | 93 | 6 |
Acknowledgements
This work involves information that I have collected from January 2019 - December 2022, and it’s only fair that in acknowledging that the work in this document is partially original at best, that I thank all the people who supplied me with the information to better understand Objective Personality as a working mental model. I will take feedback and refine the document as I go.
I would like to thank all the people I borrowed this info from, in no particular order, namely
- OPS Facebook Groups
- Dave and Shannon’s classes
- Past and present members of the Objective Personality Community, namely
- Binyamin Tsadik - Personality Interview Series
- Thomas Aylott
- Catherine Arpo
- Roqb Hosler
- Gray Capen Ceitek
- Raja Burrows - Full Blast
- Virsaviya Alexandrovna
- Lindsey Johnson - LiJo
- Laura Miller
- Jana Leigh
- Kendrick Uy - ENFP Male
- Miguel Iglesias
- Rose Ve
- NiNe Show
- Jason Mott
- Gina Di Teodoro Bryant
- Greg Kennedy
- Matthew Archer
- Adam Brooking
Non-OPS Youtube Channels/References
- Dario Nardi’s books
- Personality Hacker Youtube Channel
- Brian Little - Me, Myself and Us book
- Mark Manson’s Youtube Channel
Chapter 1 - Saviours vs Demons
Dr. Brian Little talks about your personality as being made of 3 components:
- Biogenic - Your natural inclinations and dispositions. Largely fixed.
- Sociogenic - The environment that affects how your natural dispositions develop e.g. family, community. Somewhat malleable.
- Idiogenic - Your personal projects, goals, etc that are uniquely shaped by your life circumstances. Largely malleable.
This will be largely about the biogenic part of your personality and how it shapes your behaviour, through the lens of the Objective Personality System.
Your personality has a lot to do with your natural thresholds and what feels normal for you. E.g. your threshold for control can be higher than your thresholds for variety, and so exercising control over many aspects of your life can feel more normal to you than adding a lot of variety all at once. However, people like this don’t want a complete absence of variety. It’s just a range with a low threshold.
Everyone has different ranges for their thresholds, many of which might conflict with each other, and the ideal is never achieved for long. The various settings and dispositions people have for their personality’s natural thresholds are what we call personality types.
On a basic level, personality means adaptability through variety, and as a social species, that means that we can cover a lot of ground together because everyone can help everyone else. As a hunter-gatherer, your personality would inform your role in a tribe.
While your biogenic personality type can’t change on its own, the brain is best seen as a priority system with most and least preferred pathways, so that it achieves specific goals. If the pathways are more susceptible to trauma/change, the system direction may change but the components stay the same.
But why is this important? This is important because our brain filters our reality, and our most preferred pathways will inform both how we want to operate in the world and our ideas of what the best kind of world should be. If everyone has a rationalization machine justifying whatever world they're living in, then our personalities are a big part of that justification.
We will always want to do what comes easiest to us. And if our brains’ priority systems tell us that what we want to do is actually what we should do, then we will subconsciously approach every problem looking for where we can do what’s easiest to us. We will naturally see problems in the world as needing to be solved by what we prefer. We will want to save the world with those preferred behaviours and outlooks. In OPS, we call those pathways our Saviours.
And what of our least preferred pathways? Our brains will rationalize why we shouldn’t do them. Those pathways will not make sense to our Saviours, because they go contrary to what our brains naturally want. If we learn to appreciate those pathways, we will still prefer that someone else does it. If we don’t value those pathways, we can treat them, or those who use them, with contempt or confusion. Those are the pathways we will demonize, and so we call those pathways Demons.
Comparisons between Saviours vs Demons
Context | Saviours | Demons |
Responsibility | We feel responsible to do them regardless of how much they are needed. We tend not to want to outsource them because we feel like we’re the best ones for the job. “This is my burden to bear.” | We often don’t feel allowed to do them. We want permission to do them, and tend to outsource them. |
Solutions to problems in the world | The urge to advise using more of them, and to use them first. Attached to our identities
| The urge to advise using less or none of them. We will also blame the world for having them |
Emotions while using them | Calm, bored, natural state. This is called a Saviour State | Anxious, nervous, and often anger at situations/people that make us use them. We will do them in a negative or uncomfortable state, often called a Demon Swing |
Practice | We will be comfortable putting the time to work on them. We will use them even when the situation to use them is not ideal. | We will never naturally want to do them. When made to, we will be drained due to discomfort, and never do them for long. We will avoid using them unless the situation to use them is ideal for us. |
Teaching about it | We don’t realize how good we get at them so it’s hard to give advice. | When we learn how to use them well, we tend to have more clarity with teaching them because of the practice it takes to use them. When we really want to connect with someone, we share these. |
Bragging about them | Generally doesn’t happen. They’re very easy for us | We will brag about them when we accomplish them. We will peacock about them when we feel like we can’t. |
Desire | Treated as what we are currently doing now. What we do first without a second thought. | Treated as a goal, desire, a fascination, or something to do/a problem to solve in the future. What we will want to do after our Saviours are done. |
Time of day | Tends to be what we do as the day begins. | Tend to show up nearer to the end of the day, once there are no more Saviours to do. |
Being rewarded for using them | Most naturally energizing. Generates the most optimism. | Can be draining for needing to use them, or wildly energizing for finally filling a void |
Being punished for using them | Can be slightly draining when they don’t work, but will motivate us to use it more/better and blame our Demons instead. Optimistic about working through the struggles there. | Most naturally draining. Feels traumatizing and debilitating. Issues here feel unsolvable and we never want to do them again, because you feel validated in how bad they are to you. |
Seeing other people using them | Embarrassed, critical, and defensive if people use them badly/overuse them.
Satisfaction if they use them well. We often project these onto others, and assume it makes the most sense to do. | Contemptuous and critical of people who use them badly, or overuse them. Demons are a source of blame.
Awe if they use them well because they’re seen as brave to do. |
Telling a story about people who use them | Often the hero in the story | Often the villain in the story |
Taking personality tests | Least conscious about how much we use them, aware of our limits in using them. Blind to our strengths, and may type ourselves with these functions are lower down. | Very aware of them when made to use them. We might type ourselves with these functions high. |
God** | Often talked about as the being who put us on earth to do our Saviours. Often initially talked about as the meaning to life, in early life. | Often talked about as taking care of their Demons and working them out for us. Often talked about the meaning to life, in later life. Sometimes people also talk about being encouraged to do their demons in the name of God/Jesus/their religion. |
Life Journeys | Predisposed to notice and value these early in childhood. Will aim to use these, and it tends to work for the first few decades of life. Often featured in the stories of people who “do what they love”, are naturally good at them and maximize their strengths | Learned behaviour, and often begins to be realized in situations where Saviours consistently fail you during a life crisis, often called a Tidal Wave. This is often the life discovery people have, if they have them. Demon discoveries are still framed out using one’s Saviours. |
N.B. The order of your functions as your Saviours and Demons isn't
- A metric of capacity (if you can do it)
- A metric of skill (how well you can do it/how mature it is)
Instead, they are
- A metric of responsibility (what you feel you should take care of vs what isn't your job)
- A metric of priority (what your brain will often want to do first)
- A metric of frequency (how often you do it on default).
You could have Fe first, for example, but that doesn’t mean you can feel others’ emotions, it doesn’t mean you can’t feel your own, and it doesn’t mean you can see those emotions properly. It just means you’re looking there first and feeling responsible for it.
But what does it mean to frame out your Demons, using your Saviours? To reframe how we see that question, it’s good to use Raja Burrows’ and Virsaviya Alexandrovna’s funnel analogy, in terms of containment (downward flow of water), energy (volume of water), and efficiency (purity of water).
Containment - Downward flow of water
- The water, obviously, flows in a downward direction. So the water in the 3rd layer has to pass the 1st and 2nd.
- To get to your Demons, you usually have to get past your Saviours first. Each Saviour function has to justify going down to a lower function, and so doing Demons are usually done with the aim of benefiting your Saviours. When you're doing your demons, it is often be in the context of your Saviors. That can look like Savior SFs trying to SF the NT, or Ni doms gathering Se facts to validate/disprove their Ni concept. Demon Consumes often Consume things related to what's in their Oi boxes, and it's harder and thus less likely for them to Consume something way out of left field for them normally.
Energy - Volume of water
- The first level of the funnel is most accessible, so a lot of water flows into that first layer, but the further down the water goes into the funnel, less flows down at a slower rate.
- Your Saviours are the most accessible for your brain, and as a result, you can just do them all day. Your Demons take increasingly more energy to access and sustain, which makes you want to do them less often.
Efficiency - Purity of water
- The dirty water flows at a slower rate as it moves down the funnel but as dirt gets trapped it becomes increasingly purer.
- Accessing your Saviors is easy and as a result, it's easier to use brute force and overdo them when tackling issues. But when you work on your Demons, what you won't do in brute force, you compensate for with efficiency. You access your Demons, learn to do them in a hyper-efficient way, and get out.
The Life Journeys context will be fleshed out in a future chapter, but very important takeaways will need to be understood when talking about Saviours and Demons:
- Our brains will lie to us, telling us that we only need our Saviours. Saviours feed us the escape we need to avoid the responsibilities that require our Demons, and delusional strategies for achieving our goals. Our greatest desires lie behind our Demons, and our Saviors think they can — and are obligated to —get there without the Demons. Sometimes this works, but most times and for most people, this will not be the case.
- But, on the other hand, there is the other idea that in order to work at our Demons, we have to stop doing our Saviours. But abandoning our Saviours completely won’t help us out, because we will be incomplete either way. We need a healthy balance of both our Saviours and Demons for whatever environment is required. We need enough of all functions to stay alive.
- We live in a world where our greatest desires and our natural biology are at war. We are no longer hunter-gatherers trying to survive. We live in larger and more individualistic societies where our natural dispositions don’t work well by themselves. We can’t get by in this current version in society by only doing what’s easy for us. So we grow by also attempting to do what’s difficult for us, and filling some of those roles ourselves.
To close, let’s recap what we learned here.
- In OPS, personality type is the biogenic part of our personality that wires us to have particular natural behaviours.
- Our brains will naturally have us filtering reality and project our preferred pathways onto solving all of our problems and winning at life.
- We call our most preferred pathways our Saviours, because we look at them positively and use them to approach our problems. We called our least preferred pathways our Demons, and we look at them with paradoxical contempt and fascination, because they come difficult to us, but we eventually realize how important they are to holistic growth.
- We need to do the work to acknowledge that there are things our brains will demonize, and own that negativity. In order to achieve our greatest goals in life, the narrative shouldn't be to deprive ourselves of our Saviours, it should be to retrain ourselves to actively see and seek out the value in our Demons.
Chapter 2 - Coins and Four Function Models
Coins and Dualities
One thing people tend to notice in personality typing is the existence of dualities. “I can either think or feel? I can only look at what is, or what could be?” In order to get a better picture of the subject, the best quote on this is that of Dr. Dario Nardi, in his book Neuroscience of Personality. He talks about the brain as a non-linear dynamic system.
"When you hear a term like "personality type", you might be tempted to define a type as a set of fixed traits, or deny that there are types at all. That would be a mistake. The word "type" is a shorthand term. It refers to a consistent pattern of activity, a stable and mutually-reinforcing set of interrelated characteristics to which a person is drawn towards. Like yin and yang, your capabilities, pitfalls, and potential growth areas intertwine. This idea might sound vague but it is scientific. In the Mathematics of Dynamics systems, a type is a strange attractor."
He continues:
"Regardless of starting values, the network vacillated between only two behaviours - two dichotomous polarities - as typical of many dynamic systems. A metaphor is a sink. We can pour water in the sink from any direction, yet the water always swirls down only one (or two) drains. Each of these behaviors or drains is called an "attractor".
In summary, seeing the brain as a dynamical system can give us insights into why we get dualistic-seeming behaviours in personality assessments in general. Just as well, our brains are better at expressing, and noticing, behaviours that look completely opposite from each other, than they are at understanding clearly a trait in relative percentages. In essence, we’re better at seeing the black and white extremes of behaviour, and we use black and white to understand the greys in-between.
That being said, the greys do exist, and so we have to start this off with a big disclaimer: All dichotomies are false dichotomies, but they’re easier and more useful for your brain to understand, and they’re easier for you to recognize behaviour, so we’re continuing with the useful lie that these dualities exist.
Your personality traits are therefore just more stable behavioural tendencies that can be used to predict your strengths and weaknesses over a long period of time. You can still do what comes less naturally to you, and you can be good at it too, but it will take a little more practice. Everyone is both logical and emotional, for example, and that’s the point.
Now, we’re going to get into the idea of coins, which are what we tend to express as dualities in OPS. These are the 9/10 Coins in the system:
- O/DD vs D/OO - Single Observer vs Single Decider
- Di vs De - Introversion of Decider
- Oi vs Oe - Introversion of Observer
- F vs T - Method of Decider
- S vs N - Method of Observer
- Consume vs Blast - Preferred Information Interaction Behaviour
- Sleep vs Play - Preferred Energy Expenditure Behaviour
- M-Di vs M-De - Greater force on Decider
- M-S vs M-N - Greater force on Observer
- Not a coin but still in the system - Info vs Energy - Overall weight on Energy expenditure or Information interaction
Four Function Stack Model
The first thing to consider in OPS, and any of the typing systems that involve the Cognitive functions, is the 4-Function model.

This is what an average templated function stack looks like. Without going into the next few coins, what is very important is to know that there are four general functions in this stack.
A holistically developed person, function-wise, or in OPS, an Alpha, can balance all of their functions and use all their functions when a situation requires that of them. However, what this stack lets us know is that not all Saviours and Demons are wired equally. One Saviour and Demon duality will be harder to use in a balanced way, than another.
According to the model, the functions in the middle are functions you can more easily see and balance i.e. the second and third. The functions at the ends are the functions you are most imbalanced with. The first function is so dominant as your default state that you have little to no conscious awareness. The fourth function is so weak that you are largely unaware of how much you wish to avoid it.
In terms of functions
- 1st - overused and oversensitive. This is your dominant function, your ultimate Saviour. This is the function that has a hard time managing contradictions.
- 2nd - competent in a balanced state. This is your most balanced Saviour function, because you can exhibit behaviours with this function while balancing it with the other function.
- 3rd - hobby or learned. This is your most balanced Demon function.
- 4th - life mission. The top 3 functions are relatively easier, but the 4th is a big drop-off. The same is true for the functions.
To recap
- Our brains act like a non-linear, dynamic system, which allows us to better see and express opposite-seeming behaviours.
- Dualities of personality traits in type are a useful model for us to look at personality type.
- In OPS, there are 9/10 dualities to really speak of.
- The four-function model shows us that some saviour-demon pairs are easier to balance than others. Your first and fourth functions have the most imbalance, and your second and third functions have the most balance.
Chapter 3 - Coin 1 - O/DD vs D/OO - Single Observer vs Single Decider
In OPS, the Cognitive Functions are split up into two major groups: functions on how we understand incoming information in an open-ended way (Observing Functions), and how we formulate decisions and enact actions in a close-ended/goal-focused way (Deciding Functions).
To go back to the Four Function Model, we can understand that there is a Saviour-Demon pair of functions that we are relatively more balanced with, and a Saviour-Demon pair that we are relatively imbalanced with. So in this way, you could categorize people according to two groups: People who are more imbalanced with their Observing functions (Single Observers/O) and people who are more imbalanced with their Deciding functions (Single Deciders/D). Single Observers are, therefore, more balanced on their Deciding functions, being able to use both of with relative ease (Double Deciders/DD) and Single Deciders are more balanced on their Observing functions, being able to use both of with relative ease (Double Observers/OO).
Decision Functions involve the coins Di and De, F, and T (Chapters 7-8), but essentially, they are the functions that involve internal and external points of view. Observer functions involve the coins Oi and Oe, N and S (Chapters 9-10), but essentially, they are the functions that involve gathering new information and narrowing to known information.
Single Deciders and Observers do not accept contradictions and negativity in particular areas. They can often be so focused on those issues that they cause a lot of problems in those areas themselves.
Double Deciders and Observers can calmly accept and solve contradictions and negativity in particular areas. They can often be so passive and unfocused with those problems that they don’t attempt to solve them, which can also cause issues.
Why is this the case? From a hunter-gatherer, evolutionary perspective: balance requires imbalance. People with imbalances can notice problems in particular areas, that those balanced in those areas can solve them more quickly.
Some comparisons between Single Observers and Single Deciders
Context | O/DD | D/OO |
The biggest problem | Missing Information, how information is controlled or shared. Terrified of being wrong, tricked or lied to, feels like there is some deception/trick, so they are quick to be suspicious. They will write off anything that deceived them once. | People problems, how one is compared to people and how they react. Realizes the pain in not embracing a particular point of view. Terrified of realizing that someone’s decision is not in line with the judgement they had of them. Will write off anyone that made a big decision they don’t agree with. |
Words used often | Things, events, timelines, concepts, anxiety, paranoia, stuck, fear | People, doing, they, me, you, fairness, hurtful, judged, pain |
What feels final? | A life perspective. They do not want to entertain another observation that contradicts what they already see. | Making a decision. They do not want to make another decision that contradicts what they’ve already decided on. |
Point of comfort | More comfortable going between points of view, because the focus is on the missing information. Will collaborate with anyone to solve the missing information. | More comfortable handling issues in information, because the focus is on going too far on particular points of view. |
Natural skills | Negotiation, People-based humour/charisma, Interpersonal interaction, personal growth | On-the-spot problem solving, balancing control and variety, accomplishing tasks, research |
How do they solve their major problems? | Embracing different De perspectives to avoid Di narrowness in judgement.
The points of view are used to triangulate the missing information. It's a more comfortable method than engaging in that missing information themselves. | Gathering new Oe information and Oi building on that information.
Information is used to triangulate the disconnect between the self and the tribe. It's more comfortable than stepping out of or into their points of view. |
Conversations involving people | Thingify people, talk about people impersonally. The people are categories in the story. | Personify things, talk about everything personally. The people are the story. |
People problems | They have an easy time moving back and forth on opinions with the tribe even when it isn’t easy. Rarely take people's issues seriously. Only have issues with people who conceal/twist/change information. | They have a hard time moving back and forth on opinions with the tribe especially when they feel disrespected. Take people and opinions too seriously. Have bigger issues with trust and forgiveness. |
Imbalance | They either gather too much info without narrowing it down to the essentials or narrow down on a limited window of info without gathering enough. They have issues reconciling that information does not need to be perfect. | They put a good/bad, true/false judgement on something, using one particular point of view, and then they’re done. Issues reconciling that people aren’t either good or bad, or the fact that good people can do bad things and vice versa. |
Insults/Arguments | Calmly bring everyone to a neutral state. Can manage compliments and insults being shared in equal measure. Will insult the things to preserve the people. Will jab at others and themselves. | Most afraid of offending people. Either share too many insults and are pushed away or don’t give enough insults and lashes out. Can often project conflict and feel personal attacks. |
Me and the tribe | Both good and bad | Either good or bad |
Being told to “get over it” | Okay balancing that negativity. More likely to suggest and benefit from that advice. | Not okay accepting that negativity. More likely to reject or be belittled by that advice.
|
To recap
- Single Observers, or Double Deciders, are more balanced between the points of view of themselves and people, but more imbalanced between gathering or narrowing down information, and will use people to help them solve it.
- Single Deciders, or Double Observers, are more balanced between exercising control and variety in information, but more imbalanced between going between points of view for themselves or people, and will use the information to help them solve that.
- Imbalance comes largely from not accepting negativity in particular areas. Holistic development means balancing control and variety, as well as balancing points of view.
Chapter 4 - Introversion and Extroversion
Just a brief look at what this means in OPS. We talk about extroversion in three ways: The extroverted nature of functions, the extroverted nature of the animals, and having extroverted energy. But those three types of extroversion have one particular thing in common in OPS: Your relational degree of effect to and from the external world of people and/or things, and how often you feel responsible to consult the external world.
This shows up in many coins in the system
- Di vs De
- Oi vs Oe
- Sleep vs Play
- Blast vs Consume
But as it pertains to functions, extroversion involves the first 2 coin dualities. This also means that everyone has an extroverted and introverted side.
Why is this the case? From an evolutionary hunter-gatherer perspective: Introverted functions increase yield in building an individual data point, while extroverted functions increase speed and consensus, by recognizing and understanding introverted functions. Some people need to build their depth of observations/decisions, while others need to spot those well-built observations/decisions and apply that externally for the benefit of the tribe.
Some comparisons between Introverted and Extroverted Functions
| Introverted Functions | Extroverted Functions |
Personal vs Impersonal | Personal, private, lonely, myopic. “Has a way.” Do not wish to be explained. | Impersonal, public, obvious, updating on the spectrum. “Options open.” Can easily be explained |
Application | Treated as universal and absolute, applicable in all cases. There is no comparison, unless that comparison is inward. They like conclusions, reaching final answers. | Treated as comparative and channel-changing, dependent on the different cases and times. They make room for more, they’re very open. |
Time | Gives itself more time, because perfecting is slow. | Is more urgent, because updating must happen quickly and in real-time. |
Direction | Inward. Goes narrow and deep. Tends to stack. Implodes when something goes wrong. | Outward. Goes wide and shallow. Tends to gather. Explodes when something goes wrong. |
The spectrum | Cannot see the spectrum. All one’s weight is placed in its single outlook. Traumatizing when it doesn’t work out. Can see themselves without externalizing first. Self-comparative. | Can see the spectrum, including introverted functions. One datapoint is not seen as having enough weight. Less likely to place much stock in anything on the spectrum. Can move easily when it doesn’t work out. Usually need feedback to see where they are on the spectrum. Externally comparative. |
Responsibility | Developing the datapoint. Prioritizing, eliminating, building depth/perfecting, fine-tuning, tracking consistency. | Seeing the spectrum. Expanding, equalizing, competing, updating, tracking disparities and variation. |
Demons | Internal struggle. You feel cornered on the spectrum. Demon Oi hates receiving a non-comprehensive label, living in a box that is too narrow. Demon Di hates having their identity misunderstood.
Failure is part of the process to get to them. You replace the failure with something else on the spectrum. | External struggle. You feel like there’s a spectrum you can’t see. Demon Oe feels blind to the new information coming. Demon De feels like the tribe is unknowable.
Failure is traumatizing. More calibration must be done.
|
Building up the other side | Widening the datapoint to make more room for more of itself. | Exhausting all the extroverted methods until one finds the best ones. |
N.B. You can simulate extroverted functions in your head, imagining an interaction or an outside spectrum with others. You can do introverted functions outside your head, talking about their inner monologue out loud.
To recap
- Extroversion is defined as your awareness of, affect to/from, and responsibility to interact with the external spectrum of people and/or things.
- Everyone has an introverted side and an extroverted side.
- Introverted functions can only see their personal standpoint, and so feel responsible for building it up and prioritizing depth. Extroverted functions can see the spectrum of all data points, and so feel responsible for collecting and updating data points.
Chapter 5 - Di vs De - IxxPs vs ExxJs
The motivational speaker Tony Robbins has illuminated the 6 Human Needs, 4 of which are relevant in OPS as a system. Two of these human needs, which have to do with the needs involving oneself and others, are Significance and Connection.
In OPS, Di is a self function, fulfilling the natural obligation for Significance, which is the need to take pride in who you are and what you do in your own life, as well as growth and self-assessment. De is a tribe function, fulfilling the natural obligation for Connection, which is the need to connect with others and see what they perceive as valuable.
Everyone has both of these human needs, but in order to see how many people place a lot of focus on them, it is best to look at Di vs De through the lens of Single Deciders. What we will notice is that overdeveloping one will come at the cost of underdeveloping the other. Single Deciders are split into two general groups: IxxPs who have Di as their dominant function, and ExxJs who have De as a dominant function.
This leads to similar behaviours such as feeling unseen/exposed, people-anxiety, decision insecurity, and loving people talk. In this way, IxxPs are upside down ExxJs and vice versa.
Some Comparisons between IxxPs and ExxJs
| IxxPs - Dominant Di | ExxJs - Dominant De |
Role in the tribe | To show that someone can be capable of more. To charter their own unique path, possibly separating from the tribe. Build themselves up so that tribe can be inspired. Understanding you have to be held accountable for the actions you take, specifically that you have to hold yourself accountable.
They believe that good intentions lead to good actions. | To keep the tribe together, to be mobilizers. Build others up so that they can be respected. Ensuring that results across the board are fairer. Tracking social currency to mutually get what they need from social environments.
They believe that good actions show good intentions. |
Spectrum | Responsibility to take care of themselves and their own decisions, maintaining internal consistency within themselves. Cannot easily see the spectrum of opinions.
Seeing themselves as far better or worse than the tribe is coming as a void in seeing the spectrum. | Responsibility to take care of others and tribe decisions, maintaining external consistency and consensus. Too focused on the totality of the tribe that they can’t see individuals within it.
Seeing themselves in relation to the tribe can result in a void in seeing their individual selves. |
Compliments | Wish to receive compliments, as a way to feel seen. Credits results to themselves. More likely to say, “this is all from me”. They embrace being seen as above the tribe. | Tend to deflect compliments, but compliments are primary. Credits results to others. More likely to say, “this tribe member helped me”. They are scared to be seen as above the tribe. |
Groups vs Individuals | Help individuals despite the group because helping all individuals will help the group. Quick to abandon groups who reject individual standards.
Help yourself now, to help others later. | Help groups despite the individuals because helping groups will help all the individuals. Quick to abandon individuals who reject group standards.
Help others now, to help yourself later. |
In conversation | Will speak about people individually, from a first-person perspective. Will speak about ‘Me’. Has a hard time anticipating what others may say.
Gives their personal data point so that everyone can learn.
Tells you about themselves to get your respect. You may hear/know very little about others in their lives. | Will speak about people generally, in a broad-brushed perspective. Will speak about ‘We’. Has an easier time anticipating what others may say.
Gives spectrum so that no one gets left out.
Feel connected to the tribe and love talking about tribe drama. You may hear/know very little about them. |
Validation | Depends on themselves to evaluate how great they are and can get bitter if they can’t rely on themselves. “What I say for me goes.”
Comes up with internal validation as to why they’re good enough. Identity comes from themselves. Gets respect intrinsically.
Not willing to get bad tribe feedback, and wish to be respected, so will not make themselves look bad under any circumstances. | Depends on others to tell them how great they are and can get bitter if they can’t rely on those people. “What we say for me goes.”
Comes up with external validation as to why they’re good enough. Identity comes from the person in the room. Gets respect through mutuality and reciprocation.
Willing to make themselves look stupid/embarrassing because the tribe’s opinion is currently more important. |
Priorities | Can’t see the tribe spectrum and projects their Di onto everyone. “If I prioritize this and I prioritize you then you must also prioritize this.” “If I am working in this way, and you are working with me, then you need to work this way.” | Can’t see individuals and projects their De onto themselves. “If we prioritize this, as the group, and I am in the group then I must also prioritize this.”
|
Void/Tidal wave | The IxxPs will be left alone by the tribe when they consistently take no responsibility for anyone else in the tribe. Terrified of feeling equal to/below the tribe. Ignores the tribe because their self-evaluation is the only input they care for, eliminating feedback and slowing their ability to connect with the tribe.
Realizes that not all of their experiences are unique. Realizes that there is a spectrum of opinions and theirs is just one of many, that one opinion is often too personalized to have weight, or it may not be the most authoritative. | The ExxJs will be left alone by the tribe when they force the tribe to be fully responsible for their identity. Terrified of feeling above the tribe. Punishes the tribe for telling you negative experiences about you, stopping the tribe from helping you, slowing your ability to connect with the tribe.
Realizes that some of their experiences are unique. Realizes that not all opinions are equal, that some opinions are more well-supported than others. |
Life struggle/Delusions | Understanding their role in the tribe. Being appreciated for who they are. Realizing that true connection comes from engaging with the tribe and not just building up self to share. Under the delusion that they will always be alone. ‘Me vs the world’ Loneliness in that others could never see their opinions the way they do. Fears their well-built opinion being on a bandwagon. | Understanding their identity apart from the tribe. Appreciating themselves for who they are. Realizing that true confidence comes from building up self as well as engaging with the tribe.
Under the delusion that the tribe will rise with them. ‘We are the world’. Insecurity in that they want everyone to approve of them. |
Standards/Expectations | Compares self to self-ideal of personal standards. Believes that they expect more from themselves. Judges everyone by self-standards. Harder on themselves than others. Only tries to see what everyone is doing to be distinct from/ahead of them. Can be overly competitive with self standards. | Compares self to others’ external standards. Believes that others expect more from them. Grades themselves on the curve of tribe results. Judges everyone by tribe standards. Harder on others than themselves, rarely blame themselves. Can be overly competitive with tribe standards. |
Goals | Tribe should support them first. Want to supplement their Di with a De tribe on board with their Di. | The tribe should support them later. Want to supplement their tribe De with a Di that the tribe builds up. |
Arguments | Feel they need to be convinced. Does not convince you, gives you their piece. Work with someone if your identity allows that, and avoid/be corporate with them if you don’t. | Feel they need to convince. Believes that convincing others self-validates their argument. Work with and align with someone. |
Unawareness | How much they want to connect with others. Don’t feel allowed to ask the tribe for anything, for fear of lowering their status in the tribe. Unaware of how confident they are in their own selves. Unaware of the tribe’s perspective on anything. Can lie to avoid feeling misjudged. | How much they want significance. How much they need to externally achieve according to tribe standards to feel validated. Can feel like a victim to the tribe’s bullying, like the tribe is stopping them from having what they want. Can build up resentment. Unaware in how insecure they are in their own selves. Unaware of the tribe’s perspective of them. Can be selfish, giving with strings attached. |
Moving identity | Feels like they are not allowed to not be themselves. Don’t want to compromise their identity/decisions for others. Feels like their identity gets in the way of them connecting to the tribe, even when there is conflict. | Feel like they’re not allowed to be themselves. Don’t want to affirm their own identity to others. Feels like tribe expectations get in the way of them affirming themselves, even when there is conflict. |
Opinions | My opinion is valuable, so maybe others see their opinions that way as well. | Everyone’s opinions are valuable, so mine should be too. |
The Story | “I’m awesome, I’ve put in the hours in building up who I am, why are people not accepting me?” Look for the person who everyone knows is weird, but we all lie to, since they don’t know. | “I do everything I can to be accepted by others and help them, why do I get nothing in return and never feel good enough?” Look for the person everyone tiptoes around, since they’re afraid of being made into an enemy. |
How they see the other side | Can often see ExxJs are conformist and sometimes too aggressive. Enablers, preventing individuals from being self-sufficient. | Can often see IxxPs as narcissists. Selfish, preventing the group from being built up. |
Subjective self-report vs actual actions | Desperately wanting the tribe’s approval, and then go to get everyone to align with their opinion. Solving their fear of being people pleasers/rejection, by never getting the tribe’s opinion on themselves. | Wanting to do things their own way, and then goes to the tribe for their consensus on what should be done. Solving their fear of being misunderstood by doing things for others. |
Demon Swing | Hate groups, “Everyone is against me!” and is confused why no one is on board with their identity “They should just trust me!”
| Hate particular individuals, “I do so much for you!” and are confused as to why their identity still isn’t affirmed “You make me feel worthless!” |
Some notes
Saviour Di would feel more insulted/insecure about their methods, emotional or system-wise, especially if they don’t work.
Sometimes, the people who can become the biggest narcissists, are ironically those with saviour De and a weak demon Di to the point where no one is allowed to criticize them.
How it feels to be an ExxJ using Halloween as an analogy:
- Every waking hour of the day is Halloween. Every human being, whether you've known them your whole life, or you've seen them out of the corner of your eye for half a millisecond, is a trick-or-treater. You owe ALL of these people candy. You DON'T want to be perceived as that asshole who doesn't have candy for the children on Halloween.
- The problem is, you are CONSTANTLY out of candy. The moment you get candy, there are dozens of children lined up at your door waiting for their candy.
- The mission is futile. Turn the lights off, lock the doors, and hide in the basement. Leave a sign outside saying you're out of town. Maybe they'll go away (they won't).
De: You're just one human being. How can you believe that your opinion is better than anyone else's?
Di: Because I'm not running around trying to please everyone, I'm honing my opinions. That's why it's better.
To recap
- Di is the function representing self-assessment and significance, and De is the function representing tribe assessment and connection.
- These functions are most seen in their imbalanced forms with the IxxPs and ExxJs.
- IxxPs overdevelop their Di at the cost of De. ExxJs overdevelop their De at the cost of Di.
Chapter 6 - Oi vs Oe - IxxJs vs ExxPs
The motivational speaker Tony Robbins has illuminated the 6 Human Needs, 4 of which are relevant in OPS as a system. Two of these human needs, which have to do with the needs involving organizing and gathering, are Certainty and Variety.
In OPS, Oi is an organizing function, fulfilling the natural obligation for Certainty, which is the need to take structure physical or conceptual information, and to find internal consistency. Oe is a gathering function, fulfilling the natural obligation for Variety, which is the need to look for more physical or conceptual information.
Everyone has both of these human needs, but in order to see how many people place a lot of focus on them, it is best to look at Oi vs Oe through the lens of Single Observers. What we will notice is that overdeveloping one will come at the cost of underdeveloping the other. Single Observers are split into two general groups: IxxJs who have Oi as their dominant function, and ExxPs who have Oe as a dominant function.
In this way, IxxJs are upside-down ExxPs and vice versa.
Some Comparisons between IxxJs and ExxPs
| IxxJ - Dominant Oi | ExxP - Dominant Oe |
Role in the tribe | To create order. To organize the known information so that the tribe/self has knowledge of what works. Owning the most reliable ways to live.
Believe that honing certainty will lead to freedom | To disrupt the current order. To find new information so that the tribe/self has knowledge of what to do differently. To capitalize on new opportunities.
Believe that pursuing ultimate freedom will lead to certainty |
Communication | Responsible for telling the beginning, middle, and end of the story. Narrows down information to communicate the essentials. Will find new ways to say the same things. | Want to give all the information in the story, so the information looks haphazard. The next point doesn’t necessarily build on the last. |
Natural strengths | Chipping away at the same thing over time, mastering delivery, mastering slow progress, building on known information. Builds on information vertically. | Maximizing options, mastery of learning new information, capitalizing on a new opportunity. “Builds” on information horizontally. |
Delusions | Real answers are found in reusing what works. There’s nothing better than what I’m already doing/in, so it makes no sense to gather because all the good stuff is here.
It can't be that complex, it must be simpler than this. | Real answers are found over the next hill. There’s always something better than what I’m already doing/in, so it makes no sense to narrow it down because I could get something better.
It can't be that simple, it must be more complicated than this. |
Lulls | Can’t get settled until things are in a lull. | Can’t get settled when things are in a lull. |
Plans | The more fun part is coming to a sense of completion. Gets prepared on the front end. Feeling overwhelmed when things are open-ended. They will want the order and then explore later. Hoping to find known information in something new, because otherwise, they have to gather more. | The more fun part is finding something new to explore. Gets prepared on the backend. Feeling trapped when things are finalized. They will want the novelty and then complete it later. Hoping to find new information in something old, because otherwise, they have to narrow down more. |
The story | “I’ve spent so much time building up my way/plan, I have no idea how I will cope if I have to change it.” Look for the person that everyone knows is uptight and rigid, but nobody can say anything since they think that’s normal. | “I’ve spent so much time searching for the best thing/ path in life, I’m so scared of slowing down and committing to one, in case I miss out.” Look for the person who everybody knows is unreliable and flaky, but you can’t say anything since you’re afraid of looking uptight yourself. |
Void/Tidal Wave | Planning excessively because they hate being surprised, and then getting surprised because they have limited their observations too much.
Their known information is not updated enough and so have to start all over again.
| Gathering excessively because they hate being limited, and then getting controlled because they have not narrowed down enough.
Obsessively taking in new information, not realizing that they did not prepare for it, so they have a hard time handling the new information coming to them. |
How they see the other side | Will see ExxPs as disorganized and ruining the plans with their chaos. | Will see IxxJs as boring and close-minded, ruining the freedom with their structure. |
Subjective self-report vs actual actions | Say they love gathering new things and then spend most of their time on the same information. | Say they are great at organizing, and then get overwhelmed that they gathered too much. |
Demon Swing | Blame chaos “I can’t because of chaos!” and are overwhelmed because they don’t look outside their Oi box “I’m perfecting this first!”
Get so controlling that they cause chaos for everything else around them. | Blames anything limiting them “They are controlling me!” and are overwhelmed because they refuse to narrow down “I’m keeping options open!”
Limiting control at every point so much that they have obsessive levels of control for particular things. |
Some notes
Oftentimes, society jumps onto new things that seem distinct or disparate, but we often follow similar patterns that show trends in what we see and how we behave. There are also tried and true methods that work, among the new ideas that may or may not be better than what has been established. Oi doms provide stability in the things that we generally know and accept to be true observations about the world.
Oe doms are vital for society not to end up accepting the wrong ideas or narratives because of groupthink etc, and in order to do that, they have to risk making themselves seem crazy in order to get people to question their recently beloved beliefs. If they can do that, then they have done their job because now either those beliefs will be proven to be right all along or wrong and discarded. This is another cycle. In order to grow, some things must be challenged. Personal, societal and traditional beliefs must be shaken in order to work better.
To recap
- Oi is the function representing certainty, narrowing down and building on tried-and-true information, and Oe is the function representing variety, expanding, and capitalizing on new information.
- These functions are most seen in their imbalanced forms with the IxxJs and ExxPs.
- IxxJs over-develop their Oi at the cost of Oe. ExxPs over-develop their Oe at the cost of Oi.
Chapters 7-8 - F vs T, and the Functions Fi, Te, Ti and Fe
On top of the classification of Decider functions based on introversion and extroversion, there is also the classification of how decisions are made and how priorities form. The dichotomy here is Feeling and Thinking. This is explored in some detail in MBTI, and in OPS, the definition has limits, so the best in-depth explanation that adds credence to both, from my perspective, is Detached Machine for Thinking, and Involved Machine for Feeling.
Feeling - Involved
These are some of the benefits and uses of people who have Feeling high
- Chemical-motivation/Involved priority mechanism - Letting you know what is important to you or others, based on what your chemicals immediately tell you, quickly spurring you into action in relation to what is important.
- Pleasure maximization/preservation mechanism - This can be internal pleasure such as happiness, or external pleasure such as social harmony.
- Value framework mechanism - Understanding value can lead to larger-scale value understandings such as through frameworks on what a particular belief implies for behavioural consistency or social-emotional tools/understandings that help to maintain social harmony.
- Relationship management mechanism - Allows you to use emotions to maintain relationships. This can also show up in social communication, relationship management, emotion regulation, creating vulnerability, emotional empathy, and cultivating a sense of belonging.
- Emotional bias understanding mechanism - An immediate sense of where internal or external biases lie based on what your chemicals tell you.
- Anecdotes - Speak about values, beliefs, emotions, and priorities as if they have a lot of power. Generally prefer any emotion to none, being okay going through the spectrum of emotions.
Problems experienced by people who have Feeling Low
- Lack of understanding what is an immediate chemical-based priority, difficulty making value judgements for its own end.
- Difficulty in understanding internal and external pleasure maximization
- Difficulty in relationship management
- Lack of awareness of emotional biases
- Difficulty feeling responsible for internal or external emotional regulation. Prioritizes detached discourse
- Difficulty assessing one’s emotional state, and sharing it
- Often believe that feelings are invalidated or lies if they can’t be proven. Need reasons to understand emotions.
- Have great difficulty processing bad emotions.
- Can value things but often does it subconsciously.
- Talk about thoughts as if they are uncontrolled and come out of nowhere.
Thinking - Detached
These are some of the benefits and uses of people who have Thinking high
- Detached priority mechanism - A sense of emotionally detaching to understand problems that do not need to involve emotions, or problems that emotions can detract from being able to tackle, and solving them. Therefore, the priority is the problem to be solved.
- Objective tracking mechanism - Because chemicals are not the primary mode of understanding decision success, a more detached and often quantifiable measure is used to clearly denote progress e.g. numbers, statistics, or specs.
- Detached framework mechanism - Problem-solving can lead to larger-scale impersonal understandings such as thorough internal frameworks of knowledge, or practical external systems of implementation. Having knowledge of a system to understand when and where improvements should be made.
- Reasoning decoding mechanism - Understanding premises and inferences in discourse, such as "if-then-else", "either-or". Better able to spot cognitive fallacies, logical gaps, argumentation, and debate.
- Functionality curiosity mechanism- A propensity towards understanding how tools, frameworks, and systems help us to solve problems and avoid pain. Sometimes, this involves investigating a system of functionality as an end in itself. Often motivated by problem complexity. This can show up in learning skills.
- Anecdotes - Place high priority on truth, logic, and proving points for them to be valid. Speak about thoughts, ideas, and solutions as having a lot of power, and talk about things having to work. Generally prefer a neutral state of emotions and numbness.
Problems experienced by people who have Thinking low
- Not always understanding when something is impersonal. Lack of understanding the more impersonal aspects of themselves.
- Lack of objective or quantifiable measures to particular goals.
- Decisions are not always supported by premises strong enough to be functional. Lack of awareness of cognitive fallacies in reasoning.
- Emotions felt in the moment are not always sustainable, as they can often change due to context and disappear once addressed.
- Understanding how valuable a system may be without understanding the system itself.
- Lack of creating detached skills that can be functional for implementation.
- Difficulty feeling capable to solve particular impersonal problems.
- Often believe that thoughts don’t matter if they aren’t in line with whatever they value.
- Have great difficulty choosing detached models over deeply entrenched values, and difficulty processing numbness.
- Can problem-solve some things in a detached way but often does it subconsciously.
- Talk about thoughts as if they are uncontrolled and come out of nowhere.
Because you can classify Deciders using Introversion and Extroversion, as well and Thinking and Feeling, you have four Deciders
- Di + F = Fi
- Di + T = Ti
- De + F = Fe
- De + T = Te
How these functions work in Jungian systems is that you have two dually opposite functions for your Deciders. You have to have an Introverted and Extroverted Decider, and you have to have a Feeling and Thinking function, so if you have the Introverted Feeling Decider aka Fi, you automatically have the Extroverted Thinking Decider aka Te.
Introverted Feeling (Fi)
- Di + F - Involved priority mechanism is personal. Generally is focused on what is valuable to the self.
- The axis opposite to Te, the Detached priority mechanism that is impersonal.
- Is focused on personal experiences and beliefs
- Often associated with self-worth and self-value, allowing oneself to have certain feelings, the integrity of character, understanding people from a subjective point of view, and complexity of motivation, emotion, and desire. Humour and offense are also personal. Fascinated with how values drive motivation and can hold space for darker feelings.
- Moral standard comes from oneself, values are usually not held accountable to the spectrum of values.
- Shares identity by putting out their personal values.
- Have a difficult time understanding other people’s value frameworks. Not accepting the emotions of others unless they have personally experienced it.
- Owning self-chemicals and their effects.
- Prioritizing what is most valuable to the self at the expense of the detached systems for the tribe.
- Personal credit towards a belief. Does not want to own a belief until it is understood fully.
- Fi tidal wave - Being cast out by the tribe because they are not capable to solve any problems. Does not have any organizational or efficient systems that the tribe finds useful.
Extroverted Thinking (Te)
- De + T - Detached priority mechanism is impersonal. Generally is focused on what problems should be solved for the tribe.
- The axis opposite to Fi, the Involved priority mechanism that is personal.
- Is focused on tribe utility and practicality. Often associated with tribe reasons, and correcting ineffective systems based on unhelpful values. Can hold space for dissonance in logic. What is logically consistent for one person might not be so for another, and that is okay.
- Logic standard comes from the tribe, personal logic is usually held accountable to the spectrum of logic.
- Throws out ideas on the logical spectrum for others. Ideas are not tied to identity, so sharing with the group, looking for reactions and validation.
- Is very aware of other people’s system frameworks on a spectrum.
- Prioritizing impersonal systems that work best for the tribe at the expense of personal value. The self-value comes from the achievement of the external system. Happiness is earned. ‘If this works for everyone, then I have value’.
- Unaware of their own thoughts until they are processed in an extroverted way, moving along the spectrum from irrational to rational. Not knowing which idea is sound until it is processed.
- Te tidal wave - Being insecure in self because the self is not seen as valuable independent of the tribe. Te will also make excuses to rationalize a personal Fi value state, while not doing the same for other Fi value-states in others. May hide their personal values when prompted, and may feel personally victimized when called out.
Introverted Thinkng (Ti)
- Di + T - Detached priority mechanism is personal. Generally is focused on what is logically consistent with the self.
- The axis opposite to Fe, the Involved priority mechanism that is impersonal.
- Is focused on personal frameworks, reasons, and axioms. Often associated with personal reasons, revisiting logic, the integrity of information, or the complexity of logical premises. Fascinated with how modes of thought drive decisions and can hold space for darker thoughts.
- Logical standard comes from oneself, logic is usually not held accountable to the spectrum of logic.
- Sharing identity by putting forth their personal frameworks.
- Have a difficult time understanding other people’s knowledge frameworks. Not accepting the logic of others unless they have personally logically validated it.
- Owning mental models and their effects.
- Feelings are chemical responses to information, biofeedback.
- Prioritizing the best frameworks for the self at the expense of the value-based systems for the tribe.
- Personal credit towards a solution. Does not want to own logical information until it is understood fully.
- Ti tidal wave - Being cast out by the tribe because they are not owning the value systems of others. Does not care to pick up the emotions of others. Hurting people without recognizing or caring. The tribe hates feeling invalidated by them.
Extroverted Feeling (Fe)
- De + F - Involved priority mechanism is impersonal. Generally is focused on what social frameworks are valuable for the tribe.
- The axis opposite to Ti, the Detached priority mechanism that is personal.
- Is focused on tribe values and social understandings. Often associated with culture, shame, public value, harmony, and correcting discrimination based on false logic. Can hold space for dissonance in morality. What is right for one person may be wrong for another, and that is okay.
- Value standard comes from the tribe, personal values are usually held accountable to the spectrum of values. Aligns to external value standards.
- Throws out feelings on the value spectrum for others. Feelings are not tied to identity, so sharing to the group, looking for reactions and validation.
- Is very aware of other people’s value frameworks on a spectrum.
- Prioritizing impersonal systems that the tribe values most at the expense of the personal logic frameworks. The self-logic comes from the value in the external system. ‘If everyone is happy, then I was right.
- Unaware of their own feelings until they are processed in an extroverted way, moving along the spectrum from ethical to unethical. Not knowing which value is good until it is processed.
- Fe tidal wave - Being insecure in self because the self is not seen as having consistent logic independent of the tribe. Fe will also make excuses to justify a personal Ti system state, refusing to be argued with because that system is not fully consistent with the self. May lie about their personal truths when questioned ant feel personally victimized if called out.
Some comparisons between the Fi/Te axis and the Ti/Fe axis
| Fi/Te axis | Ti/Fe axis |
De tribe skills | Te is good at handling heavy debates | Fe is good at handling heavy emotional situations |
Di and outsourcing | For Fi, thinking someone is smart is outsourced. ‘Don’t make me think you’re dumb.’ | For Ti, Liking someone is outsourced with Fe. ‘Don’t make me not like you.’ |
Di and alternate opinions | Fi - “I have built my identity on valuing this thing. If you value something else, I feel like you hate me and are trampling on my identity.” | Ti - “I have built my identity on establishing this framework. If you disagree with me, I feel like you undermine my logic and are trampling on my identity.” |
Di and respect | Fi tries to leverage into Fe when they respect their own Fi enough to respect others' Fi. | Ti tries to leverage into Te when they respect their own Ti enough to respect others’ Ti. |
Di and complexity | For Fi, every emotion has some intent or motivation behind it. | For Ti, every thought has some logical premise or mental model behind it. |
How the other axis’ Di sees the De | Saviour Te will come up with frameworks in the spectrum from moment to moment, but they might look stupid to Saviour Ti. | Saviour Fe people come up with feelings in the spectrum from moment to moment, but they might look disingenuous to Saviour Fi. |
How the De sees other axes’ De | Te scans the room for Ti and wants to connect through reasons, which is why the Fe feelings seem fake; e.g.: "Why are you smiling to my face when I can see what you're thinking?" | Fe scans the room for Fi and wants to connect through feelings, which is why the Te logic seems polluted; e.g: "Why are you arguing when I can see what you're feeling?" |
De trust exercises | Fi/Te people could work with anyone but the value is personal and so they socialize with a select few. “If I can’t work with you based on good reasons, how can I trust you with my deepest values and most important things to me?” | Fe/Ti people could socialize with anyone but work is personal so they work with a select few. “If you can’t be nice to me how can I trust that you’ll handle my most important ideas with care?” |
What can and can’t be seen | Is more likely to believe that ultimate value can never be found/known, because it is attached to identity. Truth/what works can be found, by examining the consensus of tribe logic. | Is more likely believe that the ultimate truth can never be found/known, because it is attached to identity. Value can be found, by examining the consensus of tribe value. |
Self-worth issues | When Fi/Te people have self-worth issues, they tend to talk about themselves as being worthless because of how they feel. | When Ti/Fe people have self-worth issues, they tend to talk about themselves as bad, dumb, and wrong because of specific reasons. |
Some notes
- Fi is emotional impression. Fe is emotional expression. Demon Fi can seem emotionless because they are unable to demonstrate their emotions. Demon Fe seem emotionless because they don't seem emotional expression of great importance on their behalf.
- Fe is not the same as caring about others. Fe is just seeing values on a spectrum.
To recap
- There are two general types of ways decision priorities are reached - The Involved priorities, aka Feeling, and the Detached priorities, aka Thinking.
- Because there are two different ways to split the Decision functions, there are effectively 4 Decision functions: Fi (Di + F), Te (De + T), Ti (Di + T) and Fe (De + F).
Chapters 9-10 - S vs N, and the functions Si, Ne, Ni and Se
On top of the classification of Observer functions based on introversion and extroversion, there is also the classification of how observations are made and what fueled them. The dichotomy here is Sensing and Intuition.
Sensing
- Concept Proving Mechanism - To validate a concept, sensory systems require particular facts, details, and sensory evidence that can prove it in physical reality. Sensory-proven cases are usually more grounded, and slower to do, sacrificing speed for yield.
- Face-Value Mechanism - True to the name, awareness of taking in information from the body’s senses. Able to pick up particular sensory details from the environment. The sensory information is not abstracted any further and is taken at face value for what it is.
- Bodily Awareness Mechanism - While not always able to pick up the body’s current state, tend to feel at least generally aware of changes in the body and are comfortable in their bodies.
- Sensory Task Mechanism - Is more adept at operating tasks in physical reality in a calm state for extended periods. Can maintain current sensory as it is, but is also more deeply aware of what would be needed to change the tangible environment to a different future.
- Baseline Communication Mechanism - Sensory language is used to communicate, even if abstract ideas are communicated. Therefore, this mechanism allows for giving concrete information on what happened, where people are usually able to follow what is going on. Uses sensory details, often too much, to prove an abstract point.
Problems with people who have Sensing low
- Often unaware of what they pick up with their senses, despite doing it all the time.
- May generally feel detached from/unaware of the body’s state.
- May not feel the need to prove a concept before continuing with it.
- Often have a difficult time communicating clearly, or without excessive analogies. With sloppy summaries and categorizations, the recipient might be left wondering what happened.
Intuition
- Pattern recognition Mechanism - Able to create abstractions and draw introverted or extroverted patterns from sensory information. These patterns can be connected looking backward or forward, and those with it high can usually recognize when a similar pattern is occurring again.
- Gap filling Mechanism - Most useful when there is not enough sensory information, but a pattern must quickly be drawn. Can draw conclusions and fill gaps from minimal sensory information, sacrificing yield for speed. Also beneficial when the sensory is wrong.
- Possibility framework Mechanism - Less locked into the problems of the current sensory environment, and can imagine and possibly move the tribe in the direction of how things could be.
- Connective Concept Mechanism - Creating conceptual frameworks that the sensory information has to fit into. Good for seeing the big picture of a topic, and adopting a different perspective.
- Analogy Communication Mechanism - Is more responsible for concepts, and so uses concepts, simulations, and analogies to prove points in reality, likening those concepts to the sensory currently happening in a conversation. Mentions abstract points and then fills them in with sensory details.
Problems with people who have Intuition low
- Difficulty making abstractions into what happened without enough sensory evidence, as they are afraid of being wrong with information.
- Often bothered by internal or external abstract patterns they don’t understand or feel responsible for.
- May have difficulty categorizing information into more generalized concepts.
- May have difficulty following analogies or understanding analogies without asking for classification.
- Sometimes to caught up in the current sensory to wonder what is possible.
- In conversation, you may get a lot of unnecessary sensory details and be left wondering why they are relevant to the story.
Because you can classify Observers using Introversion and Extroversion, as well and Sensing and Intuition, you have four Observers
- Oi + S = Si
- Oi + N = Ni
- Oe + S = Se
- Oe + N = Ne
How these functions work in Jungian systems is that you have two dually opposite functions for your Observers. You have to have an Introverted and Extroverted Observer, and you have to have a Sensing and Intuition function, so if you have the Introverted Sensing Observer aka Si, you automatically have the Extroverted Intuition Observer aka Ne.
Introverted Sensing (Si)
- Oi + S - Concept proving mechanism is personal. Generally focused on organizing sensory.
- The axis opposite to Ne, the impersonal pattern recognition mechanism.
- Deductive organizing. Slowly proves personal conclusions.
- Personal sensory includes experiences that have already happened and is consulting memories of what happened to refer to a new possibility.
- Is generally associated with organizing and labeling personal space, the memory of details, making something physically tangible, stocking up on sensory to be ready for anything, personal traditions, physical routines, passing on the sensory, and rules and regulation. Is also associated with acknowledging that elements of the past will affect novel ideas.
- In conversation, speaks in a grounded action sequence. A step-by-step specification of the sensory events or items. Conversation can feel specific but random.
- Si tidal wave - Feels overwhelmed by all the negative possibilities that could occur to ruin the current sensory. Fears not understanding where the chaos is coming from. Can get subconsciously over-chaotic, overworking the sensory by trying to get sensory items for any wild possibility. Does not accept any new ideas.
Extroverted Intuition (Ne)
- Oe + N - Pattern recognition mechanism is impersonal. Generally focused on gathering abstract patterns.
- The axis opposite to Si, the personal concept proving mechanism.
- Inductive gathering. Quickly jumps to impersonal conclusions.
- Is generally associated with sourcing several frameworks of interpretation, creative reinvention of sensory items, perspective taking, one insight leading to several, and using multiple analogies to explain a point.
- In conversation, speaks in abstract disorganized ways. Highlighting patterns before moving on to the next.
- Ne tidal wave - Not realizing that the sensory limits and prevents infinite possibilities. Feels controlled by the sensory things that possibilities are limited to. On a quest to create the best reality possible, and feels limited by their actual reality. Can get subconsciously overcontrolling of specific sensory information. Has a very difficult time organizing their physical things, or processing past experiences.
Introverted Intuition (Ni)
- Oi + N - Pattern recognition mechanism is personal. Generally focused on organizing abstract patterns.
- The axis opposite to Se, the impersonal concept proving mechanism.
- Inductive organizing. Quickly jumps to personal conclusions.
- Is generally associated with a singular future vision, needing to see the most likely outcome and running themes.
- In conversation, speaks in abstract pattern sequences. A step by step building of a concept, showing causality. Conversation can feel focused but vague.
- Might see one Se example that proves their point and then use it everywhere.
- Ni tidal wave - Feels overwhelmed by all the sensory information that could ruin the concept and render it a black and white oversimplification of the sensory. Afraid of the physical things that cause chaos. Can get subconsciously over-chaotic with the sensory, overworking the same concept, feel like it doesn’t need explaining, and can back it up with inappropriate sensory, or analogies alone. Can make impulsive decisions, or fears making any at all for fear of chaos.
Extroverted Sensing (Se)
- Oe + S - Concept proving mechanism is impersonal. Generally focused on gathering sensory.
- The axis opposite to Ni, the personal pattern recognition mechanism.
- Deductive gathering. Slowly proves personal conclusions.
- Impersonal sensory includes experiences that have not happened and is gathering new experiences to eventually form a concept.
- Is generally associated with experience gathering, preferring a variety of sensory sources, being competitive with facts, and sensation seeking. Is usually associated with taking immediate action in the present.
- In conversation, speaks in grounded disorganized ways. Highlighting sensory events before moving on to the next.
- Might see one Ni concept and because they haven’t narrowed it down to create any more, they see that one concept everywhere.
- Se tidal wave - Not realizing that the repeated patterns narrow down as time passes. Feels controlled by the patterns that could render all the sensory experiences and render them under-categorized repetition of the same patterns. Can get subconsciously overcontrolling of scams and hidden meanings, or make the wrong connection. Suffers from the consequences of impulsive decisions without regard for consequences.
I took a lot of notes on the differences between the two axes, so these are comparisons for that.
Comparisons between Se/Ni axis and Ni/Se axis
| Si/Ne axis | Se/Ni axis |
Hunter/Gatherer role | We live in a chaotic system and being able to navigate the chaos by extrapolating on and recording the known sensory and its possibilities can provide for wide abstract applications while maintaining physical certainty.
For example, the first agricultural revolution, a key development in the proliferation of the species. Pre-homosapiens might just impulsively eat a seed when they were hungry, homosapiens (with the capacity for time perception: comparison of present with previous events to make a future projection) on the other hand would imagine “okay, if I don’t eat this seed and I plant it, I’ll get lots of food that will feed me for longer, and feed my whole tribe”. And this is really what brought about civilisation as we know it. | The sensory understanding can still be too limited to make well-grounded extrapolations on, so gathering more sensory expands the cases. Narrowing that down to common concepts can allow for testing that understanding against known sensory, and allowing for further extrapolation.
Let’s say my tribe sends me out into the wild to find new settlement, when I go into the wild, I’m looking for a place of decent resources. On my journey, I see animals and places where substantial farming can be done. When I reflect of my Se experience, I notice a common factor that these places were all by water. When I suggest that Ni concept to the tribe, we Si notice that our current settlement is by water also, so we can Ne extrapolate that all good places of settlement might be near water. |
How the axis works | Taking the internal Si details and expanding to formulate external Ne possibilities, or taking the external Ne possibilities and narrowing down by producing consistent Si steps. | Taking all the external Se details and narrowing down to internal Ni patterns, or taking an internal Ni pattern and projecting onto the external Se reality. |
S creates N | Specific Si items can create up a whole list of Ne possibilities. Ne is all the possibilities that specific sensory things create.
You ground what could happen by what did happen (Ne/Si). To know what could happen (Ne), you only need a single example of an event happening (Si). | Multiple Se facts come together into an individual Ni concept. Se is all the facts that specific intuitive patterns are made of.
You ground what will happen by what is happening (Se/Ni). To know what is most likely to happen (Ni), you need a lot of data points on what is happening right now (Se). |
Maximizing | Focused on maximizing particular sensory items by using them in a variety of abstract ways, endlessly exploring in the abstract. | Focused on maximizing particular abstract patterns by using them in a variety of sensory cases, endlessly exploring in the sensory. |
Efficiency | Contrasts and explores various patterns, and tests them out in the real world, paying attention only to the details necessary to prove or disprove a concept. Thus, preventing themselves from being overwhelmed by loads of potentially irrelevant data. | Contrasts and explores sensory cases, and collapses them down into specific concepts, paying attention only to theories that are applicable to reality. Thus, preventing them from being overwhelmed by loads of theories and ideas that aren't even accurate. |
Planning - Backwards or forwards | Si plans forwards starting with the most reliable step in sight. Si planning is a little more short-term because sensory has to align physically, and will struggle to figure out what Ne possibility could be achieved in the end. | Ni plans backward starting with the most likely end goal in sight. Ni planning is a little more long-term because the sensory doesn’t always have to align, and will struggle to figure out or do any of the possible Se steps to get there. |
Conversation | Give personal experiences as evidence. The event is spoken about specifically. | Give general experiences as evidence. The event is spoken about holistically. |
To recap
- From Virsaviya - There are two general types of ways observations are reached - The What Machine, aka Sensing, and the Why Machine, aka Intuition.
- Because there are two different ways to split the Observer functions, there are effectively 4 Observer functions: Si (Oi + S), Ne (Oe + N), Ni (Oi + N), and Se (Oe + S).
Chapter 11 - Animals 1 - Blast and Consume
All the chapters from here on out are going to be more or less unique to OPS as a personality system. One of the important aspects of OPS is the concept of Animals.
What are animals in the OPS system? Animals are simply an emergent property of two cognitive functions working together. Specifically, animals are a combination of an Observer function and a Decider function.
Why are they called Animals? Dave and Shannon say that animals are called so because they describe the way actual animals, particularly social mammals, behave in the wild.
Cognitive functions by themselves describe a basic mechanism through which you interact with information with your primary Observer, and how you prioritize and make decisions with your primary Decider. However, an Animal describes a holistic behaviour that takes care of both close-ended tasks and open-ended information. Animals are therefore much better at tracking actions that particular personalities take. Animals are more behavioural, so they are a little more anecdotal and archetypal, as a general warning.
In the MBTI system, all function stacks and Saviour/Demon pairs go in sequential order of the strength of each function. We will look at the animals that would emerge from those conventional types: Blast and Consume, the Information Animals.
N.B the Introversion of the Decider determines the Introversion of the Animal.
Blast is a combination of Oi + De, which involves how one uses their Oi known information in relation to the De tribe. Blast is the Extroverted Information Animal. This shows up in particular ways
- Inward Tribe Organisation Mechanism - Taking diverse De opinions/results on a particular topic and narrowing that down into known Oi information. This is to create structure from tribe opinions/standards.
- Outward Tribe Organisation Mechanism - Taking the known Oi information and De aligning others on that information. This is to provide structure/control to the tribe, and to use the same information to challenge the tribe on what they believe they know. This can involve teaching/coaching, synthesising information on projects, organising lessons, and preparing loaded answers to questions. Blast is externally acting on information that one has already organised.
- Because Blast has the Oi confidence in known information, and the De obligation to gain external decision-based results, high Blast can show up as executing on information you already know, immediately producing, getting started on things before gathering information to be ready, and having false confidence in knowing all the information. One natural strength of Blast is optimising information to ensure that the most useful parts are communicated to others at every stage. Blast tends to be associated with clear and structured communication, giving the best of the basics. Blast is also better at naturally transitioning from one stage to another.
- Lead Blast will have IxxJ and ExxJ problems. With low Consume, they may teach/brag about knowing something they have previously seen others execute as if it was their own information. Not slowing down to gather new information means they could be executing on information that is incorrect, incomplete or outdated. This also means that they are limited to the same information, and have a harder time updating their information, preferring to reinforce the same information. Execution and constant transition can mean eventual gaps in information.
Consume is a combination of Oe + Di, which involves how one uses Oe new information in relation to their Di identity. It is the Introverted Information Animal. This shows up in particular ways
- Outward Self Disruption Mechanism - Actively challenging/changing Di self with divergent Oe information. Disrupting the self and forcing one’s identity to change and grow based on new information. Challenging what one personally believes is significant. Incorporating that information into your framework of understanding, metabolizing new information.
- Inward Self Disruption Mechanism - Challenging new Oe information found in relation to Di oneself. Filtering new information based on self-understanding. Judging new information by one’s personal standards of what is significant.
- Because Consume has the Oe obligation to new information, and the Di significance in self-assessment, high Consume can show up as always learning something new, respecting the slow understanding of information, under-communicating and preferring to absorb the information, and having false insecurity of not knowing enough information.
- Lead Consume will have IxxP and ExxP problems. With low Blast, they may have a hard time narrowing down their information to make it useful for the tribe and have more information than they know what to do with. They may tend to prepare to execute without feeling ready to do so. They may also have a difficult time immediately sticking to one topic of communication. Constantly filling in the gaps in information can come at the cost of execution based on and transitioning to the next stage of a process.
To recap
- Animals in OPS are behaviours resulting from two functions working together.
- Animals are better at tracking behaviours than functions and letters are.
- Consume and Blast are the Information Animals.
- Blast uses Oi known information in relation to the De tribe, and Consume uses Oe new information in relation to a Di identity.
Chapter 12 - Animals 2 - Jumpers, Play and Sleep
This is the part of OPS that tends to attract people as its own unique system. In this system, it has been recognized that Saviours do not necessarily follow the exact function stack order.
It turns out that your brain does not really care which Observer and Decider function you use as the primary functions in your stack as long as
- You have one Observer and one Decider
- Your dominant function stays as your primary Saviour. This means that your second or third function can work as your second Saviour.
What does this mean? This means that your Saviours don’t have to be your first and second functions; they can be your first and third. People with the latter as dominant functions are called Jumpers, because their second Saviour jumps their second function, to their third.
We will now look at the animals that emerge from these Jumper types: Sleep and Play, the Energy Animals.
Sleep is a combination of Oi + Di, which involves how one uses one’s Oi known information in relation to their Di identity. It is the Introverted Information Animal. This shows up in particular ways
- Energy Prioritization/Limit Oversensitivity Mechanism - Understanding the Oi known information of what is most significant to your Di identity. Actively revisiting and understanding what is most important to someone. Understanding that the body’s energy is limited, and must therefore be spent on the most important things. Often underestimating the body’s energy limits. They likely have low energy, to begin with, but they can expend large amounts of energy on things that are important to them.
- Personal Processing/Authenticity Tracking Mechanism - Ensuring that one’s Di identity is consistently in line with the Oi known information that informs the priorities, in one’s inner world. Going over how events affect the identity and the known information that comes with it. Associated with the mental chatter in one’s head.
- Because Sleep has the Oi understanding of known information, and the Di understanding of identity-based priorities, this shows up as wanting to spend time in personal projects, refining before taking action, giving limit-based reports, eliminating unimportant things in one’s life, and drawing clearly defined boundaries of one’s limits, as well as respecting those boundaries. Because accessing one’s inner world takes up energy, they often prefer low-energy activities to do on autopilot while this occurs. Less is more for them.
- Lead Sleep people will have IxxJ and IxxP problems. With Play low, this means that they are easily drained by anything that is not a clearly defined priority. They will avoid any situation that constitutes rapid feedback interaction with the tribe, as their processing can be done without tribe interactions. They dislike time-wasting interruptions. If they do not expend enough energy, it leads to atrophy.
Play is a combination of Oe + De, which involves how one uses Oe new information in relation to the De tribe. It is the Extroverted Information Animal. This shows up in particular ways
- Energy Expenditure/Limit Undersensitivity Mechanism - Being obligated to gather Oe new information to immediately share with the De tribe. Actively taking on new external obligations for the tribe in the moment. Overestimates the body’s energy limits, and therefore expends energy on anything external immediately to avoid waste. Often have high energy, to begin with, but tend to have spent too much to attend to their needs.
- Rapid Feedback Mechanism - Continuously Oe learning and updating behaviour based on De tribe interactions. Updates or aligns the tribe with new information. Learns new things through immediate conversation and feedback. Trust in the tribe to provide feedback on appropriate behaviour in real-time. Associated with social momentum and environmentally adaptive behaviour.
- Because Play has the obligation to Oe continuously learn and share information in response to the De tribe, this shows up as learning as one goes, going to others for new information, responding to any new tribe feedback, processing known information in real-time, working with others, and wasting energy. Play high can maximize connection and new information that could potentially be a new priority.
- Lead Play people will have ExxJ and ExxP problems. With Sleep low, this means that they may force the tribe to slow them down/stop them, not creating proper internal boundaries. They have a hard time relaxing, often talking about it like it needs to be earned after expending energy, and may have a deep fear of not being productive with their time. They can have difficulty accessing their inner world on their own to understand their priorities.
Some notes
The function stack itself doesn’t seem to change even if the Saviours don’t follow the function stack, and the function stack still tells you about the relative strength/ease of use of a particular function. So a non-Jumper using their second function as their second Saviour has an easier time using that Saviour than a Jumper using their third function as their Second Saviour, because non-Jumpers are more compatible with their natural stacks.
You can do Play and Blast in your head, even if they’re De. You can do Consume or Sleep out loud.
Blast - One-way animal, directed outwards to the tribe
Consume - One-way animal, directed inwards to the self
Sleep - No-way animal, processing self in no direction
Play - Two-way animal, in both directions back and forth from the tribe
Blast - Tells the same story about others
Consume - Tells random stories about the self
Sleep - Tells the same story about the self
Play - Tells random stories about others
Blast complaint – ‘I am not being heard’
Consume complaint – ‘They are controlling me’
Sleep complaint – ‘They won’t let me’
Play complaint – ‘I’m not allowed’
Car analogy for animals
- Blast – moving the car
- Consume – putting the right gas in
- Sleep – Putting on the brakes
- Play – Driving with other cars on the road
From Raja
Sleep clarity: I know exactly what works for me and what makes it significant to me.
Play clarity: I know what new thing I want to do, and who I want to do it with.
Consume clarity: I know what the new information is in a reasonable entirety.
Blast clarity: I know the information that I want the tribe to align with, and it is useful for them.
From Catherine Arpo
Di:
- Di in Sleep is responsible for timeless personal likes/dislikes/values and reasons/opinions
- Di in Consume is responsible for updating identity based on new information
Oi:
- Oi in Sleep is responsible to set a vision/framework for the self
- Oi in Blast is responsible to set a vision/framework for the tribe
De:
- De in Play is responsible for identifying tribe values/opinions
- De in Blast is responsible for appealing to tribe values/opinions
Oe:
- Oe in Play is responsible for gathering tribe opinions/values
- Oe in Consume is responsible for gathering new information for the self
From Virsaviya - Sleep visualized is also like a mind map or network graph. When one or more things are added, changed or edited in that network graph, the entire graph has to be reworked and that's kind of what Sleep processing is. Di are the nodes and Oi are the edges connecting the nodes.
To recap
- Jumpers are people who have their first and third functions as their two Saviours.
- Sleep and Play are the Energy Animals.
- Sleep uses Oi known information in relation to the Di identity, and Play uses Oe new information in relation to a De tribe.
Chapter 13 - Letter and Animal Combinations
The idea of letters as their own thing is explored in Jungian work, but they also get combined, in a similar way to the animals. As a quick, overgeneralized recap on the letters:
- F - Involved, decision-wise. Value/Belief frameworks. Concerned with emotion and importance. In OPS, this is highlighted as Value.
- T - Detached, decision-wise. Knowledge/Process frameworks. Concerned with making things work and argumentation. In OPS, this is highlighted as Reasons.
- S - Grounded, observation-wise. Takes information as it is. Concerned with tangible results and proving with slow deduction. In OPS, this is highlighted as Physical things.
- N - Abstract, observation-wise. Builds concepts on sensory. Concerned with hidden meaning and proving with quick induction. In OPS, this is highlighted as Abstract Patterns.
With the animals, the Saviour Observer and the Saviour Decider combine their letters to create a particular letter combination. In this way, the letters can be combined in four different ways:
- SF - Value in the physical. Knowing what really matters in the physical before knowing what is true in the big picture. Anecdotally, the popular person/cheerleader.
- NT - Reasons in the abstract. Knowing what is true in the big picture before knowing what really matters in the physical. Anecdotally, the nerd/awkward person/analyst.
- ST - Reasons in the physical. Knowing what is true in the physical before knowing what really matters in the big picture. Anecdotally, the practical person/boring reporter.
- NF - Value in the abstract. Knowing what really matters in the big picture before knowing what is true in the physical. Anecdotally, the hippie/sage/vibe checker.
With these four various letters and the four various animals, there are therefore 16 different animals with unique letter combinations.
- Blast - SF Blast, NT Blast, ST Blast, NF Blast
- Consume - SF Consume, NT Consume, ST Consume, NF Consume
- Sleep - SF Sleep, NT Sleep, ST Sleep, NF Sleep
- Play - SF Play, NT Play, ST Play, NF Play
Blast - “What known information can I organize that will be important for tribe opinions?”
SF Blast - “What physical things can I organize that the tribe will value?”
- Telling the tribe how they can feel better
- Enforces socially acceptable sensory etiquette
- Teaches the tribe how to look good
- Helping the tribe to be comfortable in the physical.
- Ensuring that everything and everyone creates an environment that is comfortable and safe for everyone
NT Blast - “What concepts can I organize that will be practical for the tribe?”
- Telling the tribe the practical concepts they can use
- Teaching the tribe how to use concepts in business
- Has a singular vision and implements whatever external system that can get them there.
ST Blast - “What physical things can I organize that will be practical for the tribe?”
- Giving the tribe a historical report
- Providing step-wise instructions to the tribe
- Timing an event
- Organizing the arrangement of people
- Needs to know that information can produce tangible and practical results
NF Blast - “What concepts can I organize that the tribe will value?”
- Teaches the tribe on what matters most
- Teaches the tribe what abstract concepts they should value
- Reminding the tribe about things that bring long term happiness
- Inspires and motivates the tribe, holding them accountable and encouraging them to behave a certain way to achieve their goals
- Patterns of the social spectrum
- Using an understanding to evoke a feeling in the tribe
- Communicate why your interest is important for people to know
Consume - “What new information can I gather for me?”
SF Consume - “What new physical things do I like, believe in and find valuable?”
- Engaging in enjoyable things for the self
- Gathering new things and popular trends
- Enjoying various sensory things
- Gathering new experiences to learn about what you love
NT Consume - “What new abstract possibilities do I think are true and work for me?”
- Gathering new patterns and meanings for your logical systems
- Attacking the same logical perspective from different perspectives
- Gathering new possibilities to learn about what is truth.
- Responsible to reject unfavourable possibilities
ST Consume - “What new physical things do I think are true and work for me?”
- Gathering facts and tools for the self
- Gathering key details and statistics to support your ideas
- Needs to know that information is accurate and real, regardless of what works externally.
- Take in relevant and accurate data to be updated with your interest
NF Consume - “What new abstract possibilities do I like, believe in and find valuable?”
- Gathering new ideas for the self
- Finding out the best life purpose and meaning for the self
- Responsible to reject possibilities with bad vibes
Sleep - “What known information can I organize for me?”
SF Sleep - “What known/past physical things do I like, believe in and find valuable?”
- Self-emotional awareness
- Bodily awareness
- Internally processing felt emotions. What do I feel, what am I feeling?
- Emotionally processing what was valuable about past events.
- I really value this sensory thing/routine
NT Sleep - “What known concepts do I think are true and work for me?”
- Optimizing and puzzle solving a current interest
- Taking calculated risk. Simulating the most likely possibility
- Maximizing internal efficiency and effectiveness
- Planning an internal thought sequence
- Figuring out an internal abstract pattern
- Tie information and patterns together so it build a logically consistent story
- Detangling the knots in your thoughts. Weeding out false premises.
ST Sleep - “What known/past physical things do I think are true and work for me?”
- Logical awareness and bodily awareness
- Mind and physical body that works
- Strict logical routines that you never break
- Logically analyzing what was true about past events.
- Planning an internal step by step sequence
NF Sleep - “What known concepts do I like, believe in and find valuable?”
- Projecting feelings into the future
- Finding internal purpose
- Developing a personal code to adhere to
- I love this concept/want to accomplish this goal
- Why do I feel this way, why do I value this thing?
Play - “What new information can I gather for the tribe?”
SF Play - “What new physical things do I think the tribe will value?”
- Tries every experience to see what is most valued concretely.
- Engaging the tribe using humour, expression and conversation
- Gathering the sensory things that the tribe thinks is cool. Tracking and taking in preferences and pop culture. Keeping up with preferences to further interact with the tribe.
- Creating and paying attention to social reactions and impressions.
- Naturally aligning with and amplifying the external emotional atmosphere.
NT Play - “What new possibilities do I think will be practical for the tribe?”
- Tries every possibility to see what works conceptually.
- Gathering logical concepts from the tribe
- Solving the tribe puzzle
ST Play - “What new physical things do I think will be practical for the tribe?”
- Tries every experience to see what works in reality.
- Sharing and comparing facts and tools with the tribe
- Going back and forth on what is being done wrong
- Tracking results in a concrete extroverted way
NF Play - “What new possibilities do I think the tribe will value?”
- Tries every possibility to see what is most valued abstractly.
- Trying to understand what the point is from the tribe
- Spreading abstract good feelings like love and care
- Subverting abstract societal expectations
- Double entendres
Below is a reference for the various roles

To recap
- The four letters (F, T, S, N) can be combined in four different ways to make the letter combinations: SF, NT, ST, NF.
- The four letter combinations can be combined with the four animals to create sixteen different animal combinations.
Chapter 14 - Animal Stacks, Info and Energy Dominance
This chapter will flesh out the animals some more.
Dave and Shannon realized that
- In the same way that there is a function stack, there is also an animal stack that does not necessarily conform to your function stack.
- In the same way that for your function stack, you need one Saviour Observer and one Saviour Decider, you need one Saviour Information Animal and one Saviour Energy animal. E.g. If your lead animal is Blast, Consume cannot be second. Play or Sleep has to come second.
Firstly, it is important to note what your energy and behaviour are like with just your primary Information Animal and primary Energy Animal:
- Consume + Sleep = Mopes in OPS. They double up on Di, which means that they have mastery of internalizing information internally for their own life.
- Blast + Sleep = Know-It-Alls in OPS. They double up on Oi, which means they have mastery of building on and reworking the same information and teaching energy-saving techniques.
- Consume + Play = Skibs in OPS. They double up on Oe, which means they have mastery of learning and gathering information, finding new ways to understand information, and referencing a lot of material.
- Blast + Play = Crackhead idiots in OPS. They double up on De, which means they have mastery of external execution of information, and learning from experience.
More info on the first two animals and behaviour - https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hh4_H9TOEmIx4De2OsGa0R3ajrKAOF0x/view
Because there are four animals, there are sixteen possible animal combinations that can show up in the OPS system. That will look like this
*** Show Visual ***
Your top 2 animals will determine what your energy will be like in a Saviour state, but the biggest drop-off in your animals, just like with your functions, will be with the fourth and last. So, understanding your third animal is important if you want to understand if the animal you don’t have is an Information Animal or an Energy Animal. If the animal you are missing is an information animal, then Sleep and Play are in your top 3 animals, and in OPS, you are called Energy Dominant. If the animal you are missing is an energy animal, then Blast and Consume are in your top 3, and in OPS, you are called Information Dominant.
There are two types of “Imbalances” for being energy vs information dominant, in a way that is similar to single observers/deciders vs double observers/deciders: Imbalance by overworking, and imbalance by over-neglecting.
- For imbalance by overworking, people do not accept contradictions and negativity in particular areas. They can often be so focused on emphasizing those issues that they cause a lot of problems in those areas themselves. Your level of dominance in energy or information will come at the cost of imbalance by overworking.
- For imbalance by over-neglecting, people can calmly accept and solve contradictions and negativity in particular areas. They can often be so passive and unfocused with those problems that they don’t attempt to solve them, which can also cause issues. Your lack of dominance in energy or information will come at the cost of imbalance by over-neglecting.

Some Comparisons between Energy Dominant types and Info dominant types
| Energy Dominant | Information Dominant |
In your top 3 | Sleep and Play | Consume and Blast |
What are you over-working | Immediately having an obligation to interact with your relationship to preserving or expending energy. Tend to have a more personal relationship with working or playing hard, and respects the time and energy things take. More application than dual communication. | Immediately having an obligation to interact with taking in or sharing information. Tend to have a more personal relationship with knowledge being power, and respects filling the void in communication. More dual application than application |
O/DD or D/OO, what makes you overwork this more | Single Decider. Decisions are what you take most seriously and are constantly processing people and decisions. Because you are using both your processed identity and your two-way tribe feedback animals, you will inevitably be processing self and tribe, and Deciders take that seriously. | Single Observer. Information about things is what you take most seriously and are constantly processing things. Because you are both using narrowed information to communicate with the tribe, and updating your identity with new information, you will inevitably be processing control and chaos, and Observers take that seriously. |
What are you over-neglecting | Consume - Updating your identity with new information, or Blast - Building on and working with narrowed and known information for the tribe. Doesn’t take in enough or share enough information. | Play - Expending energy in rapid feedback with and for the tribe, or Sleep - narrowing down information for oneself and establishing personal priorities and limits. Takes on too much or too little of the work. |
Talks a lot about | Doing. Do energy can come from balanced Play, especially if you’re a Decider. Therefore, lead Play info doms can relate more to energy dominance. | Learning. Learning energy can come from a balanced Consume, especially if you’re an Observer. Therefore, lead Consume energy doms can relate more to info dominance. |
Purpose of information | What the information can do – maximizing energy management. The information is made relevant by putting it into action. | The exchange of information is rewarding by itself. Action may be made on the information, for the purpose of exchanging more information on it. |
Conversations 1 | Energy conversations are about sharing your identity and how the tribe reacts to that. Energy dominance is the animal type of double deciding. | Info conversations are about sharing your conclusions and the back and forth. Info dominance is the animal type of double observing. |
Conversations 2 | Energy doms will have info conversations.. with people that they resonate with. | Info doms will have energy conversions with people who will pick apart info with them. |
Anecdotally | Goofs around first before sorting out the information, not taking information seriously. | Sorts out the information before goofing around with it. |
With each of the issues of the fourth animal, there are four ways this could occur. Many of these behaviours are anecdotes, but they help to paint the picture of the voids these types force the tribe to fill.
For Energy Dominant people, there are two types - Consume last, and Blast last
Consume last - Not taking in the self in an extroverted way
- Double Activated Blast
- Tidal wave - shock from new information from reality finally coming in, after a while of holding it back for as long as possible. Everything has to be updated. Everything new or unexpected comes as a surprise. They didn’t realize until it’s too late that they were on the wrong course.
- Have an even more difficult time if they can’t distinguish between reliable and unreliable information sources.
- Will often repeat back to you what you just said. Doesn’t remember where they got the new information from. New information that slips in is neither noticed nor internalized.
- Forcing someone else to gather for you. Keeps Consume limited in order to avoid having to narrow and Blast excessive amounts of information. Everything they take in has to fit in with their old information, that takes a while to organise.
- People complain that this type does not listen. Believes that they already know the information about to be given to them. Makes up their own conclusion about what you are saying, even when it has nothing to do with what was said. Difficult for them to take in new information for anything that isn’t already in an Oi box.
- What they talk about and give lessons on are their Blast Play experience. Can also confidently make things up as they speak.
- They use their own internal sense of self and how they interact with others' preferences/recommendations of things externally to triangulate what they would externally prefer.
- If De, can make plans without checking the tribe. They can get themselves hurt, especially if they are not invested in the plan.
Blast last - Not taking in the tribe in an extroverted way
- Double activated Consume
- Tidal wave - None of what you learned and crystallized over some period is narrowed down enough to be useful for the tribe, because it cannot be communicated or worked on effectively.
- Often feeling like you don’t have the permission to share information that could potentially be wrong. Feeling like you can’t deliver anything less than perfect information. Taking corrections can feel traumatizing. Not knowing how to package what you know into something the tribe can use.
- Spontaneously won’t communicate, spontaneously appears and disappears from social interactions/projects, etc. (“Cool Guy Disease”)
- Overshares every option/tangent related to a given topic that does not actually help meet the needs of the tribe. Especially the case for PC/CP” (“Birdchirping”). May have difficulty with serious, linear conversations where one is required to stay on topic.
- Shutting down because you don’t have any loaded information on the topic at hand. Wants to paint a picture of the whole story, so has trouble starting. Feeling excessively obligated to gather more information before feeling like enough of an authority to share advice.
- Doesn’t transition with the information because it does not feel complete. Stays somewhere too long.
- Hard time controlling people (i.e. getting people to listen and/or do things). Difficulty expressing their plan, and can sometimes drop their plans at the last minute. Expects other people to plan without appreciating what that looks like. Not updating someone along the way so they can make their own decision.
- Difficulty expressing themselves and standing up for what they need in a consistent Oi way, easier for them to avoid speaking to someone.
- Uses someone else’s Blast as a good enough approximation of what you wanted to say.
- Feels like they are not allowed to take part in the conversation of the Oi of the collective until they gather all the information about it for themselves.
For Information Dominant people, there are two types - Play last, and Sleep last
Play last - Not taking in the tribe in an extroverted way
- Double activated Sleep
- Tidal wave - You have been in your priority bubble for so long, that you failed to notice any new external opportunities for growth outside of your comfort zone, and the tribe does not bother to include you in activities. Preserving for too long, leading to atrophy.
- Feeling like all the answers must come from your own self, not realising that there are answers in the tribe that could have helped all along.
- Terrifying getting negative feedback from the tribe because it can’t be controlled.
- Forces everyone to expend all the energy for them. Always delegating tasks.
- Refusing to do anything out of their comfort zone without the tribe push.
- Struggling to follow through on things that require energy.
- Can miss out from a lot of opportunities that the tribe doesn’t bother to share with them, because they aren’t sharing much with the tribe.
- Shutting down in chaotic tribe situations.
- Difficulty having stamina to keep up with a lot of what they start. Tendency to break momentum.
- Can put too much pressure on the inner world to solve all external problems.
- May refuse to offer information if they anticipate that interaction with the tribe will then be in order.
- Can be hard to get a hold of.
Sleep last - Not taking in the self in an extroverted way
- Double activated Play
- Tidal wave - Expending for too long, leading to burnout. Your body has a difficult time keeping up with you, and so does your tribe. You have overwhelmed them.
- Physically, you can experience a crash so serious that it is difficult for your body to recover. It can make you feel guilty.
- They may have a deep fear of not doing anything productive with their time. Every moment not filled feels wasted.
- They can often be seen as too needy. They often require the tribe to spur them into action or to form their decisions. They often depend too heavily on tribe validation and reassurance.
- Forces the tribe to stop you because you won’t stop yourself. Cares so much about info that they naturally don’t care about wearing everyone down.
- They use their own opinion on things and the plans they execute/what they find themselves doing and saying to people most often to triangulate a sense of self.
- Difficulty with the known information of the identity because they aren’t processing any of that. Have issues processing past experiences or narratives that they need to revisit or undo.
- Can get stuck in bad habits and thought processes because nothing is revisited. It is difficult to dwell on anything they have experienced. Even when they make routines for themselves, it can be difficult to stick to them. Can be very difficult to focus on anything for prolonged periods or to narrow down for themselves.
- Have a difficult time understanding any boundaries. Often have a difficult time making decisions or doing things on their own.
Other notes
The deep interconnectedness of double-observers and double-deciders far surpasses the impact of Animal stack activation. So double deciders with CS and BP would have more tidal ripples than single deciders, but less tidal waves. And vice versa. Your 4th function will always be what your brain interprets as your biggest problem.
Consume respects perfecting the end product; Blast respects distributing the end product.
Play respects expending energy: Sleep respects preserving energy.
Therefore:
Info dominant types (Consume and Blast in top 3) will sacrifice energy in order to perfect AND distribute the end product as often as possible
Energy dominant types (Play and Sleep in top 3) will sacrifice the end product in order to expend AND preserve energy as often as possible.
- Sleep x2 seems to fine tune the product and distribution infinitely so when they expend energy it's perfectly efficient
- Play x2 seems to infinitely "playtest" product and distribution so when they preserve energy the resulting system is perfectly efficient
- Blast x2 seems to optimize distribution so when they finally improve the product it's perfect
- Consume x2 seems to optimize the product so when they finally distribute it's perfect
Info doms may interpret an energy dom's Sleep as Blast. So the info dom will push back on it because it is Blast, and energy doms will feel attacked because their Sleep felt trampled on.
General behaviour in communication
CS/SC - Thinks about what they would want to speak about, but will either not communicate or tell a story one-way.
PB/BP - Speaks while they communicate their point
BS/SB - Thinks about their point before they speak
PC/CP - Will speak as they struggle to communicate their point
Frequency of tidal waves
- Blast last, Play last. They have lots of small crashes. The burnout is in little ways, as they move. They are generally more self-aware, as they have an extroverted animal last.
- Consume last, Sleep last. They have a few large crashes, and can get very far before the burnout is intense. They are generally less self-aware, as they have an introverted animal last.
Glass Lizards –
- Dominant function is single activated, meaning one animal utilizing that function is first, and the other is last. There is an issue that comes from the consciousness of that last animal but having a hard time using it. This will sometimes also come from the 4th function being activated in general. The first function isn’t getting enough pull, but the last function is getting a double pull. And especially for that last animal, it feels like overheating, and you don’t feel allowed to do that last function, but you still feel obligated. There’s a lot of pain and consciousness involved.
- A double activated 4th function is a function that you are not naturally responsible for or adept at using but you feel you need to keep doing. It tends to bring a lot of consciousness to your functions.
- Even if you’re double activated on your 4th function and it’s masculine, it’s still the most traumatizing to you, specifically the human need on that last function. Your last animal is often inflicting the most damage to the people around you. They’re forced to fill the void for the energy or the info.

On extroversion, Dave and Shannon realized that
- Your animal stack combined with your function stack is actually one of the most effective ways to understand your behavioural level of introversion and extroversion.
- As said earlier, traditional energy-related introversion and extroversion is associated with self and tribe interactions. Consume and Sleep are introverted because they are connected to your Di, associated with slowly updating your identity with new information and preserving your energy for personal priorities respectively. Blast and Play are extroverted because they are connected to your De, associated with organized outward execution and rapid energy expenditure respectively.
- The animals from most introverted to the most extroverted are therefore: Sleep, Consume, Blast and Play in that order.
- If you have Blast and Play in the top 3 animals, you are generally more on the extroverted side. This is especially so if Blast and Play are next to each other in those top 3. When under threat, you are more likely to bring a problem to the external world, and it looks like immature binging when forced to go inward.
- If you have Consume and Sleep in the top 3 animals, you are generally more on the introverted side. This is especially so if Consume and Play are next to each other in those top 3. When under threat, you are more likely to bring a problem to the internal world, and it looks like immature outbursts when forced to go outward.
What that looks like is this visual

Extroversion by animals/Most normally like the lead animal
- Sleep. Most introverted/Normal - SCB. Median - SBC. Most extroverted - SBP.
- Consume. Most introverted - CSB. Normal - CSP. Median - CPS. Most extroverted - CPB.
- Blast. Most introverted - BSC. Normal - BPS. Median - BSP. Most extroverted - BPC.
- Play. Most introverted - PCS. Median - PCB. Most extroverted/Normal - PBC.
On energy vs info and Observer vs Decider
Info doms and Deciders are more balanced with information, and less so with decisions. Energy doms and Observers are more balanced with decisions, and less so with information.
- Heavier on + more balanced with info. Casual on + Less balanced with energy.
- Therefore, heavier on both observers, lighter on one decider.
- Casual on + more balanced with info. Heavier on + less balanced with energy.
- Therefore, lighter on both observers, heavier on one decider.
- Heavier on + less balanced with info. Casual on + more balanced with energy.
- Therefore, heavier on one observer, lighter on both deciders.
- Casual on + less balanced with info. Heavier on + more balanced with energy.
- Therefore, lighter on one observer, heavier on both deciders.
From Binyamin Tsadik - Info Dominance Imbalances
An info dom will be even more info dominant if the leading animal is an info one (B or C).
An energy dom will be even more energy dom if the leading animal is an energy one (S or P).
Let Info be K and energy be V.
You could consider four possible groupings.
1. The super info doms (KVKV). Leading animal is an information one AND B and C are in the top three. More imbalanced with over-working information, more balanced with over-neglecting energy.
CS/B(P)
CP/B(S)
BP/C(S)
BS/C(P)
2. The info doms leading with an energy animal (VKKV). More balanced with overworking information, more imbalanced with over-neglecting energy.
SC/B(P)
SB/C(P)
PB/C(S)
PC/B(S)
3. The super energy doms (VKVK). Leading animal is an energy one AND S and P are in the top three. More balanced with over-neglecting information, more imbalanced with overworking energy.
SC/P(B)
SB/P(C)
PC/S(B)
PB/S(C)
4. The energy doms leading with an info animal (KVVK). More imbalanced with over-neglecting information, more balanced with overworking energy.
CS/P(B)
CP/S(B)
BS/P(C)
BP/S(C)
This could also be more emphasized with Single Observers and Deciders. A Single Decider will be overworking energy, and a Single Observer will be overworking information.
Theories from Gray:
- Energy dominant observers and Info dominant deciders have sort of a glass lizard effect - they have their feet in both struggles at the same time, causing tension between the opposing programs.
- Info dominant observers and Energy dominant deciders tend to have an all in on saviors effect - they underestimate how difficult the opposite game is because they are all in on their main program.
- Sensing info dominants are more info dominant than intuitive info dominants, as they're unwilling to skip any of the details. Sensing energy doms seem to sometimes identify with info doms as a result.
- Feeling info dominants are more info dominant than thinking info dominants, as they're unwilling to take the wrong action. Feeling energy doms seem to sometimes identify with info doms as a result.
- Intuitive energy dominants are more energy dominant than sensory energy dominants, as they're unwilling to cite their details. Intuitive info doms seem to sometimes identify with energy doms as a result.
- Thinking energy dominants are more energy dominant than feeling energy dominants, as they unwilling to stop the action. Thinking info doms seem to sometimes identify with energy doms as a result.
- Blasters seem to identify with energy dominance (get results or gtfo), and consumes seem to identify with info dominance (get info or gtfo).
- Plays seem to identify with info dominance (get info from tribe or gtfo), and sleeps seem to identify with energy dominance (get results from tribe or gtfo).
The spectrum would look like this
- Most Info-type info dom = Super info + O/DD + SF + CP in top 3 = CSBP Se/Fi, CPBS Se/Fi, BPCS Si/Fe
- Least info-type info dom = Info w leading energy + D/OO + NT + BS in top 3 = SCBP Ti/Ni, SBCP Ti/Ni
- Most energy-type energy dom = Super energy + D/OO + NT + BS in top 3 = SCPB Ti/Ni, SBPC Ti/Ni, PBSC Te/Ne
- Least energy-type energy dom = energy w leading info = O/DD + SF + CP in top 3 = CSPB Se/Fi, CPSB Se/Fi
To recap
- You have an animal stack in addition to your function stack. It informs your behaviour, communication, and your level of energy.
- There are sixteen possible ways these animal combinations could be made.
- Understanding your top 3 animals can also give you insight into whether or not you are energy dominant or information dominant.
- Energy dominant people have Sleep and Play in their top 3 animals, and Information dominant people have Blast and Consume in their top 3 animals.
- Energy dominant people have either Consume last or Blast last, and information dominant people have either Sleep last or Play last.
Chapter 15 - Function Modalities, M-S, M-De
It turns out that there are two different ways that each function can express itself. They have two different levels of intensity to them. Dave and Shannon call these the sexual modalities, indicating that there are Masculine and Feminine functions, representing the function type with more intensity and less intensity respectively. To clarify against possible gender stereotyping, what they tend to mean is Shovy vs Compliant, Forceful vs Moveable or Active vs Passive. For the system’s purposes, we will go along with Masculine and Feminine, denoted by M- and F- respectively.
The data on this is anecdotal at best, and there is still not enough information on how much ‘weight’ functions normally have, but the rule seems to be that, like with coins, if a function is Masculine, the other function on that axis must be Feminine, and vice versa.
M-Function
- Having a difficult time moving, updating or adjusting. Everything in this realm had more ‘weight’. Where your certainties tend to lie.
- As a Saviour, feels aware and certain. Using it with confidence.
- As a Demon, feels unaware and certain when made aware. They feel harder to do anything about and can be avoided.
- According to Jason Mott, a masculine function is a function that feels established/complete, and so the information it carries feels difficult to move.
F-Function
- Difficult to store anything, because moveability causes a lot of complexity that takes more brainpower to track. Where your uncertainties tend to lie.
- As a Saviour, feels unaware and certain. Using it with moveability.
- As a Demon, feels unaware and uncertain. So hard to keep track of that it is hard to address.
- According to Jason Mott, a feminine function is a function that feels incomplete/unfinished, and so the information it carries feels easy to move.
Comparisons between Masculine and Feminine functions - Oi vs Oe
M-Oe/F-Oi
- “I know there's always another path (in reality or conceptually) + I do not adjust to shut down paths”
- M-Oe - Requires less new info to feel like something is new. New information has lots of weight and needs to be thoroughly internalized, so it drains the new info it has completely. Can seem like Oi.
- F-Oi - Requires more of the same info to feel like something is known. Known information has less weight and so can be updated more easily to a adapt to a known domain. Less confident in known info, so it can feel moveable. Can seem like Oe.
- F-Oi - The chaos will not change and thus the plan at hand must be adaptable for all potential chaos.
F-Oe/M-Oi
- “I know the one path (in reality or conceptually) + I do not adjust to novel paths”
- F-Oe - Requires more new info to feel like something is new. Rapidly moves between new info, rather than doing what it sees as repeating what it already knows. Still feels like Oe.
- M-Oi - Requires less of the same info to feel like something is known, so it’s a lot more confident and doubts that what it has stored is subject to change. Still feels like Oi.
- M-Oi - The plan at hand must not change and thus must account for all potential chaos.
In order of widening, it seems like M-Oi, F-Oi, M-Oe, F-Oe
Comparisons between Masculine and Feminine functions - S vs N
M- Sensory/F- Intuition
- M- Sensory - facts (data that will not easily update)
- F- Intuition - explanations (ideas that update easily)
- Spatial and Temporal awareness.
- Can take the exact word choice of statements very seriously
- Drawn to texture, leverage, weight and physical feel of an object
- Can describe details more often since the sensory is not moveable
- Better at logging timelines
- Tend to shove on the sensory with more force.
- Keeping the sensory stable for the patterns to move around. F-N is moving the patterns
- Defense - “To protect what I know, the sensory is immovable, since theory must be backed up by hard facts - how else can I verify I know what I know if not by what is provable in the real world?”
F- Sensory/M- Intuition
- F- Sensory - evidence (data that updates easily)
- M- Intuition - theories (ideas that will not easily update)
- Visual and Conceptual awareness
- Can mess up the words and not care because the point still stands
- Drawn to light, colour and understanding objects through abstractions
- Difficult to describe details
- Worse at tracking time
- Tend to interact with the sensory in a softer way.
- Trying to use the sensory to fill in a concept. M-N is pushing the sensory aside with a lot of force.
- Defense - “To protect what I know, the patterns are immovable, because sensory is fallible and can be an outlier, while patterns are aggregate and less likely to lie - how else can I verify I know what I know if not by looking for what ties the sensory together?”
Comparisons between Masculine and Feminine functions - Observers
Si - What did happen
- FSi - what has happened the most
- MSi - what has lasted the longest
Se - What is happening
- FSe - what has just happened
- MSe - what has lasted until just now
Ne - What could happen
- FNe - what could happen next
- MNe - what could last from now
Ni - What will happen
- FNi - what will happen the most
- MNi - what will last the longest
Comparisons between Masculine and Feminine functions - Di vs De
M-De/F-Di - ‘Dog energy’
- M-De - If you can't handle me punching you, then you can't handle reality's tidal wave. So I will punch you on the front end to test your resolve, even if it hurts because I'd rather be the one hurting you than letting the universe do it.
- F-Di - I need to let myself be tested by others, so I won't confront myself on what my standards are. It would be a disservice to your mDe if I was mDi.
- Overly sensitive to aligning people’s Di. Sees the tribe as immovable.
- Conflict is a “first resort” in order to get (potentially) hostile/resentful Di stacking out in the open and re-aligned with everyone else. Causing pain with the tribe in the frontend for less pain in the backend.
- Initial assumption about people is that everyone is aggressive on the outside, and harmless on the inside when pushed.
- Compromising tribe-standards is seen as difficult and requires force.
- Can make the tribe feel like you’re too aggressive.
F-De/M-Di - ‘Cat energy’
- M-Di - If you can't handle putting yourself through the same standards I hold myself to, then you can't handle reality's tidal wave. So I will punch myself hard on the front end to test my resolve, even if it hurts because I'd rather be the one hurting myself than letting the universe do it.
- F-De - I need to let you test your own standards, so I won't confront you on what those standards are. It would be a disservice to your mDi if I was mDe.
- Overly sensitive to respecting people’s Di. Sees the self as immovable.
- Conflict is a last resort - and once the line is crossed, the M-Di has “permission” to completely ruin the other person’s life. Causing less pain with the tribe in the frontend and more pain when pushed in the backend.
- Initial assumption about people is that everyone is aggressive on the inside, and harmless on the outside unless pushed.
- Compromising self-standards is seen as difficult and requires force.
- Can make the tribe feel like you’re too passive/neglectful.
In order of widening, it seems like M-Di, F-Di, M-De, F-De
Comparisons between Masculine and Feminine functions - Deciders
Fi/Te - Fi Personal values
- M-Fi - Immovable. F-Te - I will therefore flow along with tribe reasons instead.
- F-Fi - Moveable. M-Te - I will therefore punch at the tribe with reasons/proofs.
Ti/Fe - Ti Personal reasons
- M-Ti - Immovable. F-Fe - I will therefore flow along with tribe values instead.
- F-Ti - Moveable. M-Fe - I will therefore punch at the tribe with values/emotions.
Ti-M is the most non-moveable decider, and Fe-F is the most moveable decider.
Modalities - FF, FM, MF, MM
When it comes to typing, however, OPS mentions the sexual modalities as the mixture of two specific functions, M-S and M-De. The first letter represents the modality of the sensory function, Si or Se, and the second letter represents the modality of the extroverted decider, Te or Fe.
What this results in is the following:
- FF - Tester/Visual
- FM - Visual/Tester
- MF - Audio/Kinesthetic
- MM - Kinesthetic/Audio
Tester (FF) masculine functions are
- Ni and Fi
- Ni and Ti
- Ne and Fi
- Ne and Ti
Visual (FM) masculine functions are
- Ni and Te
- Ni and Fe
- Ne and Te
- Ne and Fe
Audio (MF) masculine functions are
- Se and Fi
- Se and Ti
- Si and Fi
- Si and Ti
Kinesthetic (MM) masculine functions are
- Se and Te
- Se and Fe
- Si and Te
- Si and Fe
How it looks like masculinity is interpreted in OPS, using the sexual modalities as a guide (MM, MF, FM, FF) is "The degree of forcefulness to which you use your sensory predisposition in relation to the tribe." It's a working definition, but it's easy to break down.
- The sexual modalities are defined by the sensory function (first letter) and the tribe function (second letter).
- For people on the Ni/Se axis, masculinity is defined by how forceful your Play is (Se + De) - How you use new sensory information in a rapid interaction with the tribe's values/reasons.
- For people on the Ne/Si axis, masculinity is defined by how forceful your Blast is (Si + De) - How you deliver your known sensory information to move the tribe's values/reasons.
- It also makes sense as a tribe relation. In this society, conventional masculinity is defined by how you are, but more importantly, what you show to others, so that they call you a "masculine man."
- Conversely, in OPS you could define femininity in relation to masculinity, "The degree of passivity to which you use your sensory predisposition in relation to the tribe." You could also give it a working definition for itself, "The degree of forcefulness to which you use your intuitive predisposition in relation to your identity."
Anecdotes
- There are ways to re-code the Masculine and Feminine functions, not just by looking at the modalities of S and De, but by looking at the modalities of the Saviours themselves. Laura Miller prefers using the Willful vs Obedient Model in this fashion.
- This is not necessarily associated with learning styles, the debunked idea in pop education psychology.
- The conventionally most externally masculine type also has the conventionally most internally feminine type, and etc.
- MM prefers to move the environment, testing their bodies actively. They use larger muscle groups.
- FF prefers to be moved by the environment, testing new things actively. They use smaller muscle groups.
- Visual/Audio do more taking in information, the perception axis. Tester/Kinesthetic do more environmental interaction, the movement axis.
- The modalities also have a stack. If you are MM, you then have MF, FM and FF in that order.
- Masculinity can also be talked about with animals or letters.
- Visuals are the most ‘introverted’ of the sexual modalities. In order, it’s MF, FF, MM, FM. This is because of the M-N to bring the concept to words, and the F-Di fear of being bullied by the tribe. In terms of extroversion, the most extroverted from most to least is MF, MM, FF, FM.
- In the conventional masculinity spectrum, the order from most to least is ST, SF, NT, NF
- In the logical spectrum, the order of force from most to least is M-NT, M-NF, M-ST, M-SF
- In the value spectrum, the order of force from most to least is M-SF, M-ST, M-NF, M-NT
- MM Play, an intense outer world, implies a FF Sleep, a very moveable inner world. Vice versa is true for FF Play and MM Sleep. MM Sleep puts as much pressure on themselves and their inner world as MM Play puts on people and their outer world.
- In terms of speed of conversation
- F-De takes longer to make things palatable to the tribe, M-De is more direct and willing to offend.
- M-N takes longer to bring their conceptual understanding to sensory words than M-S. Less lagtime with memory.
- From most to least speed – MM, MF, FM, FF
- FF tends to be the most fluid to the activities of all the modalities.
- M-S is memorizing physical information. M-N is memorizing patterns to get to, or stemming from the information
- FF Role in the tribe
- Detect subtle differences and changes in the smell and taste of food, which has been evolutionarily useful. This can often involve slight changes in chemicals, including temperature, concentration of a particular chemical, toxicity etc.
- Experiment with new materials in a specific way before the tribe can understand its uses
- Detect changes in tribe health from being able to detect changes in smell
- Detect changes in weather i.e. smell, pressure, wind, light, vibration


- Your memory is strongest when you have Saviour M-O, Saviour Oi

- You’re more likely to push on yourself if you are - Saviour Di, M-Di, Saviour F
- You’re more likely to push on others if you are - Saviour De, M-De, Saviour T
To recap
- Each function has a Masculine type that is more intense, certain and immovable, and a Feminine type that is more compliant, uncertain and moveable.
- In typing, the ‘Masculinity’ of the modalities is determined by M-S and M-De.
- This leads to four modalities - FF, FM, MF and MM.
Chapter 16 - Anecdotes and Stereotypes
Anecdotes – Stereotypical examples that fall apart if you use them to type someone. They’re bad shortcuts that we tend to want to take because they are easy. Compiled from Dave and Shan’s classes and the Facebook Groups.
Mental/Physical patterns - Loose associations at best
- Narcissism and lead Di + Ti
- OCD and high Play ExxPs. Also some IxxJs
- Derealization disorder and lead Se
- Weed seems to amplify observers. Saviour M-N aren't too keen on it, and have bad experiences with it. M-S seems to like it.
- Anxiety is often linked to not knowing, not being prepared – high Play, high gather, high single observing, high sensing.
- Decider energy and shyness are a bit related, due to the fear of judgement.
- Autism and Sleep first
- Sleep low and Sleep last people associated with ADHD
- HSP seems to be associated with Saviour sleep and emotional sensitivity.
- Stereotype of LGBTQ+ - 40 percent or more
- Males- FF – Fe/Ne, FF-Ni/Fe
- Female- MM- Se/Ti, MM-Ti-Se, MF-Ne/Fi
- Female MM xSTPs tend to have immune and joint issues, as well as chronic pain.
- Lots of interesting health issues come up in the same modality of a particular type with the same first animal.
- Twins – Tend to have similar modalities, mostly the same letters, and are the same single observer/decider
- Having an inner monologue is associated with Saviour T and M-N
Stereotypes
- Ne – Very good at the meme game.
- People who talk about bullying the most – M-De/F-Di
- Debating/Proving something to you – M-T
- Stereotype of many xM ExxJs who are conventionally called Karens. Punching on everyone around you out of feeling threatened, and feeling like a victim if people attack back.
- ExxJs are weird about the tribe and so when a member of the tribe frustrates them, they’re more likely to go to the media/other tribe about it, instead of the person. Gossip stereotype
- IxxPs and Imposter syndrome
- Trend ExxJs tend to make lists of what they want in their future partner because they have to fill the void in identity
- Cool guy stereotype – Audio, SF, DD, CP
- Lots of crazy people are Consume last observers – A great non-self-awareness.
- A lot of gurus and religious leaders seem to have Consume low. Jesus – FM – Ni/Ti – SBPC
- Nerd Stereotype – NT, OO, BS
- Stereotype lazy person – Saviour F, CS. Demon T and demon BP = demon doing.
- Patterns associated with humour according to D and S– Audio, Di, NF, Energy Dom, Double decider
- People who are good wordsmiths/rappers– often MF or MM, many are Ni-doms
- F-Si – associated with visual planning and bullet journals.
- There is some associations with more liberals being Oe and NF, while more conservatives are often more Oi and ST
- Anecdote – Play lasts are the most self-conscious offendable type
- Communication problems often come with low blast and demon Sensory, in terms of delivering the information.
- Many Grammar Nazis are most often M-Si 4th.
- Exceptionally curious people - CP Skib, Double up on Consume/Play, have an ExxP function stack
- Stereotypically Selfish on the frontend from most to least - Di/Oi, Di/Oe, Oi/Di, Oe/Di, De/Oi, De/Oe, Oi/De, Oe/De. The most selfish people will just me more upfront with it
- Tough Girl - Physical Strength and Repressing Emotion, ISTP
- Cool - Bundle of male fantasies. Kind of detached and undemanding, ISTP
- Weird - Looking at what most overlook, sarcasm "disappointed idealist", wit and freedom, NFP
- Manic Pixie - Super idealist, ENFP
- Smart - intellectual curiosity, not fitting in, not one-dimensional, INTP
If Cognitive Functions were logical fallacies
- Fi - Ad Hominen
- Ti - Personal Incredulity
- Fe - Appeal to Emotion
- Te - Appeal to Coercion
- Ni - Hedging
- Ne - False Cause
- Si - Anecdotal evidence
- Se - Tu Quoque/Up for Debate
Evolution seems to have opposites attract in a social species so voids can be filled and you can make up for lost time, but at the same time, assessments of romantic and practical compatibility for long-term relationships is very recent and our hardware likely still needs to catch up.
Relationship
- A lot of people who are your future spouse’s exact type are horrible human beings. A lot of people who are a type very incompatible with you are wonderful human beings.
- We will partner up with people sometimes because they see the other side of our functions/animals that we see but find impossible to do.
- The Cheerleader/Nerd Dichotomy is a broad and rough juxtaposition in looking at SF vs NT
- The part of someone you love is also the part that drives you crazy, because they’re filling a lot of the roles you don’t fill, but it’s hard to relate to them.
- Who is playing the roles? What roles do the relationships make you fill?
- Ambitions. You have to get on the same page for your goals.
- There might be a better base compatibility with someone, but it’s YOUR relationship. Fill it with the things that you both want, and if you’re both happy, you won’t even care.
- Variables of the parts
- Opposite sexual modalities, especially opposite sensory.
- Same decider coins – Ease of decision communication
- Opposite human needs
- Opposite animals
- Opposite letters – in the same quadrant in that case
- .
- Opposite last animal – Plays into human needs
- Opposite Decider/Observer – not as needed.
- Opposite functions might not work since you’re not speaking the same language
- Opposite energy vs info might be frustrated
- That stereotype of how men and women are, ‘Women feeling all the feelings post-breakup and then getting over it after a few months’, while ‘Men are okay/neutral for a while and then the feeling begins to eat away at them later, sending them into depression’, actually looks a lot like Saviour Feeling for women and Demon Feeling for men, which is a bit of a stereotype.
- De females and Di males are often seen to be the ‘standard’.
- Stereotype of FF CS/quiet laidback men with MM PB/outgoing fiery women
- Stereotype of MF CP men with FM BS women
- Observer functions in relationships,
- Ni/Se - Wants someone who fits into their idea of a good relationship narrative, and then they will want all the best sensory for it to fit in. They must communicate that vision of a relationship. If the vision no longer aligns, they may drop the partner. Every sensory case of a relationship is different.
- Si/Ne - Wants someone who fits into their reality of a comfortable sensory environment, and makes them comfortable, and they will want all the best perspectives to fit into that. They must communicate that reality of the environment they want the relationship to fit into, as well as the steps that can allow a relationship with them to work. If the relationship is no longer comfortable for them in the sensory, they may drop the partner. Every sensory case of a relationship is the same and can be boiled down to steps.
Worst mumblers
- Blast last – hard time structuring for the tribe
- T – Hard to connect with others
- CS/SC – void in extroversion
- FM – translating visual to sound (FF, MF, MM)
- Decider – Afraid of offending the tribe.
- M-De - Afraid of being bullied by the tribe.
Measuring introversion by exhaustion isn’t comprehensive.
- You can be Saviour De and doing everything for everyone and neglecting your own needs
- You can be Saviour Di and exhaust yourself by pushing to impossible standards
- You could be Play above Sleep and burning yourself out and crashing.
- You can be Sleep above Play and be exhausted by tribe chaos
Not wanting to bother the tribe
- Blast last
- Feminine energy
- Introverted energy
- Demon De
- Decider
MBTI types to the OPS types
The type that usually will correlate most with MBTI is a standard, non jumper type that has both of their saviours masculine, their top saviour double activated by the top 2 animals, and their 2nd savior double activated by their first and 3rd animals. Basically, saviours amped up as high as they will go, in stack order.
- IP: ?F-Di/Oe-CS/P(B )
- EP: ?F-Oe/Di-CP/S(B )
- IJ: ?M-Oi/De-BS/P(C)
- EJ: ?M-De/Oi-BP/S(C)
If saviour N then Feminine sensory. If saviour S then Masculine sensory. So that gives you:
- INFP: FF-Fi/Ne-CS/P(B)
- INTP: FF-Ti/Ne-CS/P(B)
- ISFP: MF-Fi/Se-CS/P(B)
- ISTP: MF-Ti/Se-CS/P(B)
- ENFP: FF-Ne/Fi-CP/S(B)
- ENTP: FF-Ne/Ti-CP/S(B)
- ESFP: MF-Se/Fi-CP/S(B)
- ESTP: MF-Se/Ti-CP/S(B)
- INFJ: FM-Ni/Fe-BS/P(C)
- INTJ: FM-Ni/Te-BS/P(C)
- ISFJ: MM-Si/Fe-BS/P(C)
- ISTJ: MM-Si/Te-BS/P(C)
- ENFJ: FM-Fe/Ni-BP/S(C)
- ENTJ: FM-Te/Ni-BP/S(C)
- ESFJ: MM-Fe/Si-BP/S(C)
- ESTJ: MM-Te/Si-BP/S(C)

Deciders
- Demon Fe- People are not being truthful, therefore I don’t trust them.
- People who talk about feeling misunderstood is sometimes a feature of intuition, and often a feature of demon Te
- Groupthink is a Demon-Te kind of fears
- Order of making your emotions a big deal, least to most – high Fe, high Fi, low Fe, low Fi
- People who can be largely unaware of emotional processing of anything at all often have Oi+F low (so demon Fi Sleep or demon Fe Blast).
- Demon M-De, especially f-Di lead often have big mental health problems as it comes to the tribe. The tribe is unmovable to them and that can bring a lot of complexity.
- Loose association between Demon Di, especially Demon Fi, having emotional support dogs
- Sometimes Demon Di people are more religious as a way to compensate for their demon.
- Too much F can look like perfectionism or procrastination. When you have plenty of energy to rank the priorities, but missing the energy for doing the boring things.
Observers
- Demon N – Often labelled the most crazy, because they’re bothered by abstract things they don’t understand or feel responsible
- "How you do anything is how you do everything" is a very Si anecdote. Similar to "Your perception of reality defines reality for you" is kind of more Ni
- The majority of the people in the Bible who were visited by God were through their intuition – visions and dreams.
- Pattern of Demon Ni people seeing ghosts.
- Single functions have a hard time managing contradictions. E.g., lead M-Se saviours might see 100 scientists conclude on a topic where 99 agree on A and 1 agrees on B. Because many of them refuse to use their Ni and draw a best-fit line on the data they have so far, and then see that it’s statistically more likely for the outlier to be wrong, they need universal perfection in the Se. Even if they’re right, they don’t have enough information to say that. They will want someone to convince them, making someone else responsible for their Ni (It’s also very difficult to convince anyone in this state). They will see this as all-or-nothing thinking, where they have to disbelieve everything or believe everything. They’re not in a position to have a position, because they haven’t done any research and understood how what they’re researching connects to a larger picture.
- Saviour Se is in a lot of the makeup industry.
- Se accesses Ne by consuming Si.
- Ne accesses Se by consuming Ni.
- Ni accesses Si by blasting Ne.
- Si accesses Ni by blasting Se.
Masculine functions
- Demon M-N – ‘I already know what’s going on’ – Being mad about having to predict the pattern and then fighting on the pattern.
- Masculine Te – If someone tells me that I can’t, screw you, I will prove it to you.
- M-T - Needs to make total sense to them logically for them to get on board.
- M-F - Needs to align with their values fully for them to get on board.
- Saviour F-Ti – ‘You won’t do what I will do, and that’s why I’m better’ shoving on the tribe
- Saviour M-Ti – ‘I will do what no one will do, and that’s why I’m better’ shoving on the self
- Competitiveness is probably associated with which functions you’re shovy on, and your shovy extroverted functions.
- There is sometimes an association between Synesthesia and feminine sensory, while masculine sensory and ASMR
- Fem-F can get very giggly or sad with moveable emotions.
- Feminine Intuition likes the Mind like water analogy.
- A big difference between M-Fe and M-Te as saviours is that when something very emotional happens, the M-Fe will go through emotions to the extreme but they can do it in a saviour state and it will not really affect their identity. The M-Te will have their value-based identity hit and completely shut down.
- M-Oi - tailoring an internalized outcome
- M-Oe - ensuring that the new thing is the best on the spectrum objectively
Masculine vs Feminine - stereotypically
- Introversion more feminine than extroversion
- Sleep more feminine than Play
- Consume more feminine than Blast
- Observer more feminine than Decider
- Feeling more feminine than Thinking
- Intuition more feminine than Sensing
- FF more feminine than MM
- Most Feminine would be MM- Ni/Fi -SCBP
- Most Masculine would be MM- Te/Se - PBCS
Masculine Letters
- M-ST – Excessive aggression on objective details
- M-NT – Overconfidence in knowing how the big picture works.
- M-NF – Overconfidence in knowing what the most valuable thing is.
- M-SF – Aggressive in physical reality, on chemicals.
Feminine Letters
- F-ST – Very easy to work with
- F-NT – Abstract outer space brain
- F-NF – Value in the abstract is always moving, very hippie.
- F-SF – Sexually moveable
Masculine Animals
- Sleep - Strong inner world, but difficult to move/update
- Consume - Knows what they want as goes after it, but aggressive about what they take
- Blast - Powerful communicator, but aggressive with the tribe
- Play - Punches the outside world, doesn’t take hints from the tribe very well
Other
- Dave and Shan don’t see Shadow Functions. They see combining two functions as a makeshift thing.
- F-Se can look a lot like Ne.
- Many Demon M-Oi require a plan even if they want to be spontaneous. They just might not take responsibility for that plan.
- Double Observers are calmer with conspiracy documentaries, and Double Deciders are calmer on reality TV
- Lots more ExxPs built brands on Youtube because of their affinity for new. There are a lot less Si doms. Lead Ni and info doms also show up on Youtube a lot. Visuals are among the rarest.
- Nx Consume over Blast – needing to understand it to talk about it.
- One characteristic about NF, especially Fi/Ne, is that some things need to be believed to be seen, as opposed to ST types, who often take the approach that things but be seen to be believed.
- Anecdote – Si tend to have the smallest font on their websites
- Anecdote – red hair on Ne/Fi, Fi/Se, Te/Ne
- Demon M-Fi hate when they aren’t invited to tribe gatherings.
- Reading books is not Consume. You can read books to get known information, in Sleep.
- You will be traumatized by whoever has your 2nd Saviour as their 1st, because you use it responsibly but still see the imbalance that they don’t see.
- IxxPs with high Play can sound a lot like De, because they’re expending with the tribe and have awkward decider energy, which is typical of MBTI ExxJs. Conversely, ExxJs with high Sleep can sound a lot like Di, because they’re preserving for themselves with awkward decider energy, which is typical of MBTI IxxPs.
- Nx Blast last – How will I know if I don’t know.
- Anecdote - Sleep high tend to have low energy throughout the day and more energy in the evening. Sleep low tend to have the opposite.
- Late night commercial advertisements often appeal more to single observers because they often put their faith in things. Ideologies, concepts or actual material things.
- Consume + M-Di – Might attempt to Blast from the angle of ‘How does this make me better’ but that is still a Consume attitude, taking in information for the self
- SBPC – Not distracted by De or Oe, very extreme with what they’re doing. Most BP with one narrowed thing.
- Saviour Sensory + Sleep last – Taking in an incredible amount of sensory and regurgitating it out without processing it as much
- Di and Consume last – Will give you their opinion but also will not listen to yours.
- Often times, Demon Sensory and Demon Blast have a hard time communicating
- SB – Experts at taking information and drawing different insights from the same information
- Tester Consume with feminine sensory tend to like new foods to taste.
- MM SF Play Demon where you’re FF NT Sleep Saviour is among the most hulk-like you could get.
- Play above Consume – Hearing something that may not be correct but if it’s socially proven by a tribe, accepting it without validating it for yourself.
- Consume above Play – hearing that everyone will go along with things, but doing your own research yourself.
- There are many cases of Sleep last users completely crashing in their 50s.
- Lead NF and Blast low – I can’t tell you. You had to be there to see the concepts and feel the feelings.
- BSCP have a hard time as true introverts because they’re tribe oriented and play last. A lot of drain after.
- Single observers have deer in the headlights eyes, fixed eyes. Double observers are going to be looking at observations
- Sleep last start to experience a weardown for their bodies later in life.
- Saviour FF SF Play has a very social chameleon-like nature.

Nicknames that make fun of everyone, using humour as leverage for the Hero’s Journey.
Chapter 17 - Typing someone’s personality
Typing is done using the method of double-blind testing.
Nine Coins
- O/D
- Human Need 1
- Human Need 2
- T/F
- S/N
- 2nd Animal
- 3rd A, Info/Energy
- Modality Sensory
- Modality De
Typing Don’ts. Don’t track type using someone’s:
- Abilities - any activity they do
- Verbalized preferences - anything they say they like
- Self-beliefs - Anything they have come to believe
- Occupation - What their job is. They could be doing their Demons.
Typing Do’s. Track someone’s type:
- Using the coins. Don’t type a whole person. If you can work the first 3 coins, things are very narrowed down.
- Using their emotional triggers relative to their baseline, to tell if they’re lying or not. Saviour and Demon states.
- Using their cyclical tidal waves.
- Using what they’re not doing, or what it takes a lot of time to do.
- Using their consistent patterns, as they will mostly do their Saviours.
- Using their over-imbalances, what they are overworking.
- Relative to large numbers of people. Everyone’s type is being graded on a curve, and everyone has a slight or extreme lean to one side.
- Using the roles they naturally want to play
- Using longer-form content like interviews, where they start to slowly relax into their Saviour state. If they were pretending, they can’t for too long in those interviews.
Typing checks
- Energy - Are they super extroverted or super introverted? Who aren’t they?
- Biases – What are your assumptions or guesses? What do they visually look like? Make a note of all your data points.
- Provable Coins – Can you prove the presence of one coin and the lack of another? Can you predict their life pile?
- What is their life story about? Where do they feel stuck?
- What void are they leaving others to fill?
- What are they finally discovering is possible?
General notes on typing
- We tend to write type like Modality – S1/S2 - A1A2/A3(A4). E.g MF - Se/Fi - CPBS.
- Typology is hard because you have to attempt to get out of your functions’ projection to see what’s actually being said.
- EVERYONE DOES EVERYTHING. The question is, how quickly do they do it, and how calm are they when they do it
- The first animal is already implied when typing, but is technically still a coin in personality. So there are 10 Type coins, but 9 Typing coins.
- When typing using the Binary coin method, The functions don’t really exist. E.g., Fe doms = Decider + De + Feeler
- Insults tend to hit hardest when you have the same functions as someone i.e. in the same quadra.
- When you can’t understand what people are saying about their decisions or observations, it’s possible they’re playing a different game than you e.g. function, human needs, types.
Typing yourself
- You are likely the worst person to know your own baseline. OPS stresses that you generally cannot type yourself very well.
- Ask for honest and comprehensive reviews from others.
- People who care too much about type start projecting their Saviours and type themselves upside down. People who prefer to look critically at themselves, understand their subjectivity, and are less emotionally invested in what their type is tend to type themselves better.
- Expose yourself to personality typing and the system. Track your tidal waves and where you feel stuck.
- Remember that you may not relate to everyone who is your same/similar type.
The following articles mention OPS as the system itself, its limitations and its possible futures.
Chapter 18 - Criticisms of the System
OPS is not a perfect system by any means, and it is still worthy of criticism.
The major criticisms are as follows:
- Top down vs bottom up - OPS has a bottom up approach, without a top down approach. They might be able to show people many consistent patterns to particular aspects of human behaviour, but leaves a void in terms of its underlying premises e.g. theology, epistemology, interpretation of how the world works, what to do about personality type etc. "The system of thinking behind the research has an inconsistent worldview."
- Inconsistent terminology - Difficulty being able to actually define some of the terms beyond broad brushed simplicity. As a result, some sensory examples to support particular conclusions can look contradictory, and lack congruence.
- Ambiguous framework - OPS has several confusing justifications for a behaviour that makes it difficult to pinpoint the behaviour accurately. The frame is ambiguous with multiple explanations.
- Further organisation needed - The content could be more organised as a framework, especially using the classes.
- Not derived from Jung - OPS is inspired by Jung, but they don’t use the terms in the same way he does. They haven't separated the function terms used in Jung's original work from how they currently use them. It is therefore difficult to distinguish the core differences between function definitions in OPS vs in Jung's work and socionics.
- Not scientific - OPS is currently a loose theory at best and a robust hypothesis at worst. Dave and Shan also don't have enough people currently typing to account for their own bias. Double-blind typing can help to account for individual bias, but the work still needs to be put up for scientific scrutiny.
- Overreaching - Leaning into being able to predict more robust scientific things (e.g. mental disorders, physiological conditions etc) can be dangerous.
- Visual typing - Leaning into visual typing can be dangerous because it is still one of the weakest points of consistency. Under visual typing goes guesses around features like hair colour, baldness, facial features, BMI, muscle mass, coordination and hormone levels.
- Current lack of scale - The sample size of the typing database, admittedly, still too small. They have typed mostly public figures who have done a lot of interviews, which currently limits the sample size.
To improve the system, the following would be recommended:
- Clearly define the system - Make it clear what is actually being tracked. Figure out the actual system. Define the worldview that is made clear when the understanding of the OPS system is reached.
- Clearly define terms - Redefine all terms from the top down. Understand and make clear the differences in terms between OPS and Jung’s function framework. Make the system internally congruent with itself.
- Update terms - Take a lot of current terms, e.g. activation, saviour vs demon, etc., and update them to fit the unambiguous understanding of the internally congruent system.
- Submit to science - Take all the work you have, and submit it to the personality psychology community, the neuroscience community, or whatever scientific community is present. Otherwise, OPS will be limited to potentially groundbreaking but currently fringe pseudoscience.
- Separate the supplementary - Factors such as facial features, mental disorders etc., are far more scientific, and should be left alone as interesting coincidences until more progress can be made with the theory itself.
- Ask for assistance - If this is not something that Dave and/or Shan can accomplish, they should ask for assistance from people in the community who have further credentials in academia, with reference to personality psychology, behavioural tracking or neuroscience.
- Take people along - Teach people how to type with the new and improved system that has been developed. This could, with time, help the scale issue as well.
Chapter 19 - Other Models
Just some information on other models I found.
Quadra Socionics Axes 1
- Alpha - (Si + Fe) positive in the moment emotions, or (Ne + Ti) Structure encompassing grand overarching possibilities, axioms apply to all circumstances, anything is possible as long as you can make sense of it
- Beta - (Ni + Fe) selected emotions, greater meaning, may struggle with wanting to replace the external world with something new and purpose or (Ti + Se) imposing a personal truth onto reality, boundaries and lines, success has more to do with fame/appearance to the collective. Also, clan-like.
- Gamma - (Ni + Te) No system applies to every circumstance, so it will be tested to see if it works before it is no longer rejected, decidedly not being swayed by what's popular at the time, or (Fi + Se) rather than being the boss, it's not wanting anyone to be the boss of them, personal independent achievements, strict judgements of trust and deciding feelings and how they can work with the person, never looking to belong but who is personal.
- Delta - (Si + Te) Day to day aspects of practicality, doing things as well as you can, seeing knowledge working in real life, self-sufficiency, or (Ne + Fi) good faith judgement, giving people a chance, benefit of the doubt, exploring perspectives, personal potential, struggle with the internal world.
Quadra Socionics Axes 2
- "World accepting" - Si/Ne. Inconsiderate observation. Exploring all the possibilities of what the world could be. Axis of all the possibilities of what could happen in the world (Ne), and savours the aspects of the moment (Si). Magnifying/Intensive/Unifying attitude, directly experiencing objects but associative experiencing their impressions of said objects.
- "World rejecting" - Ni/Se. Considerate observation. Rejecting possibilities that take away from the desired outcome, seeing the world as a linear path (Ni), and the energy to push things along that path (Se). Ambitious, targeted, restless to achieve. Exploratory/Non-committal/multifaceted attitude in the sense of perspective. Ne doesn't commit to a viewpoint because it wants to explore more.
- "Integrity seeking" - Fi/Te. Inconsiderate decision. Collection of data, improvement/reassessment of knowledge given factual evidence (Te), and relationships with psychological distance e.g. like, dislike, which are often kept stable, may have black and white value judgements (Fi). Maintaining integrity towards the factual truth, even if the mood of it isn't conveyed clearly.
- "Clarity seeking" - Ti/Fe. Considerate decision. Digitizing information, preserving the internal consistency of a structure (Ti), and altering the emotional mood of people, in that mood exists and can be shared. Also portraying moods and understanding of them accurately (Fe), while the ethics/treatment may be dependent on mood.
Socionics - Cognitive Styles
- Causal determinist (analytical, positive, deductive)- ENTP, ESFP, ISTJ, INFJ
- Dialectical algorithmic (synthetic, negative, deductive) - ENFJ, ESTJ, INTP, ISFP
- Holographical panoramic (analytical, negative, deductive) - ESTP, ENFP, INTJ, ISFJ
- Vertical synergetic (synthetic, positive, inductive) - ENTJ, ESFJ, INFP, ISTP
http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.php?title=Cognitive_Styles
It's a pretty interesting thing that layers some complexity on how people see the world. I don't fully understand it but it's actually pretty interesting.
https://youtu.be/iloTS0wU9qM
Ti - Possibly epistemic rationality
Te - Possibly instrumental rationality
On the different kinds of empathy, and I feel like anyone does this to some extent:
- Sympathy feels like Di, particularly Fi.
- Natural cognitive empathy feels like Te.
- Natural emotional empathy feels like Fe.
- Learned/Sympathetic cognitive empathy feels like Ti.
- Learned/Sympathetic emotional empathy feels like Fi.
- Compassionate empathy is some combination for ultimate empathy, possibly an Alpha State.
Applying Gretchen’s Four Tendencies to OPS animals
Responding well to outer expectations (external calls to organizing something) can be seen as Blast, with its opposite being Consume. Responding well to inner expectations (internal calls to organizing something) can be seen as Sleep, with its opposite being Play.
Your two dominant animals dictate your tendency
- Saviour Blast + Sleep - Upholders
- Saviour Consume + Sleep - Questioners
- Saviour Blast + Play - Obligers
- Saviour Consume + Play - Rebels
Further, your top 3 animals dictate a lot
- BSCP + SBCP - Upholders/Questioners
- BSPC + SBPC - Upholders/Obligers
- CSBP + SCBP - Questioners/Upholders
- CSPB + SCPB - Questioners/Rebels
- BPSC + PBSC - Obligers/Upholders
- BPCS + PBCS - Obligers/Rebels
- CPBS + PCBS - Rebels/Obligers
- CPSB + PCSB - Rebels/Questioners
Functions: The pros and cons of how your brain prioritizes a way of looking at the world and making decisions
Enneagram: The pros and cons of one's core desires.
On Erik Thor's site (generic mbti)
- x1x2 e.g 1=N, 2=P
- NP - Ne saviour
- SP - Se Saviour
- SJ - Si Saviour
- NJ - Ni Saviour
- xx12 e.g. 1=T, 2=P
- TP - Ti Saviour
- FP - Fi Saviour
- TJ - Te Saviour
- FJ - Fe Saviour
- 12xx and 1x2x are ambiguous, but it indicates your hero and your critic.
https://link.springer.com/article/10.3758/s13415-014-0331-6
Agentic and Affiliative extroverts.
- Agentic - Saviour T, especially Te
- Affiliative -Saviour F, especially Fe
Fisher Types – limit is that the scan is on 36 people.
- Dopamine - Oe, Ne, high Play
- Serotonin – Oi, Si, high Sleep
- Testosterone – M-Sensory, M-Thinking
- Oestrogen – M-Intuition, M-Feeling
STAR Personality Type (likely Kiersey type and external function)
- S(Structure) -IxxJs, high Te
- T(Task) - IxxPs, high Ne
- A(Action) - ExxPs, high Se
- R(Relationships) - ExxJs, high Fe
"Female archetypes"
- Femina - has some ISFP properties
- Islander - has some ExxP properties
- Regal - has some IxxJ properties
- Entrepreneur- has some ExxJ properties
The Big 5 also sounds a little like an ENTP made it as well.
- Extraversion low -CS, high -PB
- Agreeableness low – M-Di, high – F-De sounds like Ti and Fe
- Conscientiousness – High – Oi, Low – Oe
- Openness – Low – Oi, High – Oe, sounds a lot like Si and Ne
- Neuroticism – not in the OPS code
Chronotypes - kinda
- Lion – II?
- Bear – IE
- Wolf – EI
- Dolphin – EE. Dave and Shan see Sleep low/last

Maslow sounds like an ENTP – If you get your Si in order, then Fe, then Ti, then Ne
Dario Nardi - Analytic and Harmonizing functions, with 4 Bio-social styles. A lot like the modalities.
Chapter 20 - Hero’s Journey
Dave and Shannon are primarily using OPS as a framework for understanding your own blindspots and improving your life. They talk about the Hero’s Journey a lot.
Saviours and Demons
Steps
1- Realise that just your saviours won’t work
- We are demanding from the universe that things fit into our saviour functions. Someone else must do our demons for us. We want the world to come and fill in our voids. Your life story is about overdoing your Saviours for the sake of your Demons, and we do not want information that contradicts our Saviour journeys.
- You can do your saviours all day long if you want, but you will pay for that with your demons. If you don’t deal with your darkness, many things are going to trigger you. People who are most unaware of their darkness are the most dangerous because they use their demons in the worst way, and will blame anyone but themselves. If you don’t understand your default state enough – Not only will you hate your demons, but you will bite and attack those who want to help you with your demons. Sometimes you have to let time wear you down to truly embrace your demons.
- Part of the issues we have is when we get stuck in things we think should happen. We tend to assume that the world we live in is the world that everyone else lives in. If you’re all in on your subjective perspective, eventually reality will have this crash on you so that you realise that it is not working. Reality has no obligation to bend to us.
- You can’t get hurt by/don’t care about things you’re immune to. You can only get hurt by things that cause you pain, and if they cause you pain, they’re a part of you. So if decider issues cause you pain, then you cause decider issues, and vice versa.
- Whatever Saviours you want, you don’t have enough. You don’t have all 8, so you don’t have enough.
2 - Accepting the value of your demons
- When you truly see functions, you don’t have the luxury of going unconscious. Your demons default to a fixed mindset, so you have to approach your functions with a growth mindset because it is traumatising to see all the problems your demons cause you.
- The reason you’re so abusive with your first function is because of your lack of awareness of your last function. The bigger problem isn’t overusing your saviours to figure out your demons, the bigger problem is disrespecting your demons.
- Your demons don’t have to make sense to your saviours. Stop trying to make them. You can’t expect different results without different behaviour.
- We’re our own life’s homework. Working on your demons makes it easier on the backend.
3 - Where do I start?
- Remember that you are not stuck. It’s all in your head. Outside of basic needs and systemic opportunities, you are not stuck. You work through demons by being able to see them and slowly working through them in a patient and more self-compassionate way.
- Trauma isn’t necessarily going to force your demons to grow. Sometimes you can double down on your Saviours. Your demons usually grow from parenting, training or realizing that your Saviours just won’t work. You make more room for running to your demons the earlier your saviours begin to fail you.
- Knowing how to do your 4th function and 4th animal are the most important for your self-growth.
- According to Shan, most of your problems shouldn’t be blamed on your 4th function intrinsically. It comes most often from a lack of either double observing or double deciding (essentially a lack of using your 1st and 4th functions in tandem) and from a lack of using your 4th animal.
- Model the people whose lives are actually working for them. The people who own their demons and do well in life do so regardless of type.
- In reality, happiness comes from rarely feeling stuck, and you keep moving by getting the bar consistently ahead of where you are.
- Remember that personality is behavioural. Functions aside, animals aside, different behaviours can get you to similar places. Grow with at least that first.
- Outsourcing your demons isn’t necessarily bad, but you should still be responsible for the basics of your demon in case something goes wrong and you have to fix it.
- Track yourself on your own bullshit. Track your language. Track what you say. How much do you put things on yourself or others/ Take ownership for all the aspects of your life, and check on the stuff you outsource. Monitor where your massive fears are coming from because most of the time, it’s just your brain lying to you. Make tests to catch yourself.
- Ask the tribe if you are as good as you say you are, and ask for help. It will actually be relieving to the right tribe when you are working to own your negativity and grow.
4 - Doing the work
- Growth is external, healing is internal. Don't neglect either.
- Lower the bar. Goals force accountability and direction. Systems help you get there. You can’t get to a higher ended goal without owning the lower ended issues. To get to where you want to go, you either up your skills to meet your fantasy in reality, or lower your standards to meet reality. Lower your standard for your goals. Don’t expect random motivation either.
- But push the needle. Do things in the meantime so you don’t have to wait on your goal. You have to reach a state of abundance to give from the best place. Conquer things like bills and fears first. Conquer the lower-ended stuff. Your entire life is going to be dealing with small stupid things. Perfectly lay one good brick, and you will soon have a wall. Do things and find systems that allow you to do all 8 functions.
- Appreciate spots of peace. You don't NEED every function and animal on all the time. Just a little bit of ownership goes a really long way to getting things done. Don't underestimate the ability to not always needing to double down (the privilege to just do your saviours until you NEED to do your demons). Find out how much of your demons are actually being required of you.
- You will have waves of hyperawareness. You will have many moments where you will see functions in your life and the lives of other people, almost on default. You will see your freakout as well as the freakouts of others. For yourself, you have to respond to yourself with much more compassion and understanding. For others, see ‘Helping other people with their tidal waves’ below.
- You don’t need to only do your Demons now. Your Saviours can still save you in some situations, just not all of them. The goal is to be able to use your demons when they are required of you, not all the time, and not 50/50.
- Humour. Lots of people cope with being bad at their demons by using humour, but it can allow you to feel good enough to assume power over it.
- Environments. To get better at growth, you need to engage in at least one environment where your demons are required of you. Some environments are more conducive to your particular Saviours or demons. Some will want only your Saviours and you will eventually get bored. Some will want only your demons and you will eventually get stressed. Some will want a combination, and that’s often when you grow the most.
- It’s going to be hard, so account for failure. You can often go through hell by using your Saviours, and sometimes you should see that as applicable to your demons. You’re going to get persecuted. Expect to be laughed at for your demons every step of the way. Pushing through the thing that is hard for you is what forces growth. Let yourself be known for making mistakes. Plan to fail at your demons. Failing is really calibration.
- Simultaneously, assume it’s easier than you think it is. Even if it’s hard, it’s still easier than YOU think it is, because your brain will either tell you that you’re amazing at i, or that it’s absolutely impossible. Both premises are wrong.
- Anticipate having to use your demons, and leverage them for your growth. An example is in Zach Button’s Theory of the Power of the Last Animal
System example - Fire Flag system. Be prepared for
- 1-2 code red days a week – Tidal wave days, bare minimum. Take care of your health. What do you need to eliminate/process
- 3-4 code yellow days a week – Took some hits, feeling low, do maintenance, go through the motions. Lower the bar, push the needle.
- 2-3 code green days a week – Good day, high energy, do the most important, high energy stuff.
Helping other people with their tidal waves
- Sometimes, when people are about to go through tidal waves, let them. Let them struggle and want to get better a little bit more, but don’t shield them from their tidal waves.
- Focus on yourself. "Oxygen mask" analogy. Take care of yourself before you take care of others. Build so they want to come to you. Prep for when it hits, and sneak in some new info when they are sad and vulnerable. Recognizing you have a choice and you're not obligated to everything.
- Acting on what is already true or real for you, connecting your identity with the information you already know. Act on the advice you give that applies to you. Maintain order and stability for yourself.
- Accept that you cannot save everyone. In fact, you won’t save most people. You don’t get to pick and choose who wants to get better. People will learn what they need to learn, when they need to learn it, and maybe they won’t even do that. The majority of people want to be justified in their feelings and function delusions, and you will have to let them go. Go through your grieving process, try not to take this or their attacks personally. Help those who seriously want to get better and are putting the work in. Don’t say goodbye, say see you later.
- If you’re on the self-growth path, and you’re with someone who is not on the self-growth path, mutually challenging them to be their best self is also important, so the relationship won’t work if they’re not on that path with you.
Alpha State – Someone who uses their first and fourth function together. Becoming a more complete version of yourself. The human need doesn’t change, but the letter does.
O/DD and D/OO
- Watch the Doubles when you’re single. E.g. If you’re a single observer, watch what double observers do.
- Double Deciders – Use self and tribe to help you figure out your observations.
- A good double decider technique for single deciders to use is to find out what the differences are in information. That way, interpersonal interactions become much calmer.
- “Unhealthy single observing can lead to unfair single deciding. During a bad time period in my life I was observer freaking out about how bad alcohol is for you, and then anyone I saw drinking I immediately labeled them as a bad person. “
- Single Observer/Oi advice – put more stock into a variety of the most likely observations.
- If you’re a Single Decider, it helps to make fun of yourself every once in a while. No one is judging you.
Human Needs
- Tidal waves for Demon De – Not taking care of the tribe, not having the tribe needs met. Not checking your ‘competition’. Don’t over-inflate your ego. Look at what needs to be done.
- Di – If you want acceptance from others, sometimes you will have to be willing to move.
- De – If you want self-acceptance, sometimes you will have to be willing to stand your ground.
- Demon De tip - Gentle reminder that what you can care about the tribe reasons/values and the tribe doesn’t know. Intention isn’t enough. Listen to the tribe to see what needs to be done.
- De lesson – Everyone’s opinions are not actually equal. People have different levels of built opinions. The person who put time into building that opinion over 20 years has an opinion that matters more than the person who hasn’t considered it. When you put the time into building up your identity, you will earn your place in the tribe. If you want to build your opinion and put confidence in your opinion, you take the time to build up your opinion and earn that confidence.
- De realisation – In their self growth, they realise that they may be ahead of the tribe in some things and they can’t go to the tribe for every decision.
- Di – Align with an identity to want others’ opinions.
- De – Align with a tribe that pushes you to go with what you want.
- Demon Di life discovery - is giving your own self permission.
- Demon Di – Need to put pressure on yourself to overcome something of importance to you, so that when you teach, it comes from a particular kind of place.
- Di lesson – Idiots and bad people still have their specialty. You can listen to them in the field of their specialty.
- A large part of growth for De people is learning to live with people being angry, disappointed, and upset with you. They need to learn that you're not their personal little helper bot. I've had enough De people in my life to see by now how dehumanised they often are by the people in their lives. Your usefulness makes THEM feel guilty, so they have to see you as a little less than human to cope with allowing you to do everything for them. They're the ones who have to adjust here to you and it's gonna take a bit of time.
Deciders
- Deciders are childish and so they need to learn to grow up and accept pain and shame /F/ or unfairness and non-perfectionism /T/
- Humility for Ti – You don’t know how this game ends. You don’t know what you don’t know.
- If you don't have Ti in your stack, to build Ti, look at what Te works for everyone and test them each to see which one works the best in that particular scenario
- Demon Fe tip – Figuring out how tribes and individuals work to make long lasting friendships and relationships
- Demon Ti tip – Figuring out their own framework of understanding to strengthen their identity and create an internal map for making personal life decisions
Observers
- Demon Se tip – Find new experiences while minimizing chaos
- Demon Ni tip – Figure out how to plan long term by creating systems and putting them in place
- Demon Se - Look for physical problems to attend to, first thing in the morning, so it doesn’t surprise you as much.
Letters
- Demon F – Actually allow yourself to cry and process your emotions.
- Tidal waves for Demon NF – Cherry-picking ST data based on your own NF biases and realizing that the accuracy is limited or the data is meaningless. Not understanding the vibe. Use your NF every hour or so. Keep the vibe light, try to se what they’re feeling, try to guess what they’re going through.
- For Feelers – When you’re having emotional issues, you have to go to work and resolve things.
- Lesson for NF – If you feel you’re doing okay, what are your numbers. What is your objective track record
- Discovery of Saviour T – I’m allowed to express and be responsible for what I like/what others like.
- To Saviour T – Prove the logical point in a more loving way.
Animals
- Sleep low lesson – Filter your old story through positivity. Reinterpret your world view. Look at the ‘should-have-beens’.
- Advice for Consume ExxPs – If you can Consume, can you put it into a healthy spot in your worldview/
- Blast high lesson to connect – Stop teaching things you don’t believe in.
- Consume last tip – Make yourself see the things you know you don’t want to see.
- Advice to Consume low - attempt to listen as much as you speak
- High Play tip - Confidants to ping off of. Process out loud. That's kind of how I self-interview.
- Sleep low/last advice - In the social sphere, don’t approach it really wanting to get something out of it for yourself. Be more calm and interested in them without expectations
- Play lesson - Get a lot of rest before and after the event.
- Consume saviors can help consume lasts by presenting the options the blasters are unaware of and helping them learn to ask better questions so they can be more independent when learning in the future.
- Blast last tip – Start with your point.
- Play last advice – Use your personal systems for everything so that you don’t have to overwork your last animal.
- Consume high tip – Have you really learned if you haven’t organized the information enough to teach it/
- Blast last tip – Go and learn on the way.
- Blast last realization - You can’t grow if you’ve been working on one thing for way too long. Get something done.
- Blast last tip – Treat everything like a shitty draft, that you have several tries for, even if it’s a lie.
- Life for people with low Blast and low Play tends to be better on the backend. Soon enough, things feel routine.
- Sleep low - The Jordan Peterson advice on sorting out your own life first before dealing with others is actually very good for him as a Sleep last, and is good for ExxJs with Sleep low (though he overgeneralizes it and the philosophy still assumes that the main problem is personal and not systemic).
Modalities
- This also seems to happen with masculine functions. A lot of problems come when people can’t let things go. When they give up and let go, things actually get better for them
- Have some time to rage and manage your intensity, for your MM.