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Julie Lindsay: Web 2.0 panel session
chris chater: Hello everyone
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Vicki Davis: http://www.tinyurl.com/backchat - password necc
Vicki Davis: If you wish to join the backchannel - type the address up above and type the passcode necc
Vicki Davis: Just join us and ask your questions and throw them in the backchannel - get out your laptop and contribute!!!
Julie Lindsay: a passing fad......more like an embedded pedagogy...?
Rotty: kids are asking for a more collaborative environment web 2.0 give us some tools to facilitate that!
Vicki Davis: tinyurl.com/backchat Passcode: necc
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Vicki Davis: It is just like a piece of paper and pencil - we don't talk about it but they are part of a good schoolhouse.
Julie Lindsay: 21st century learners need to communicate, collaborate and create...web 2.0 provides the scaffolding for this
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WOScholar: No doubt, Jakes. Our leaders have to grasp the content area tie ins or it is a loss before the game begins. It is not technology PLUS the content work.
Vicki Davis: @WOscholar - it is never ABOUT the technology, it is always about what the technology lets us do
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Vicki Davis: If you have a laptop and want to contribute to this conversation - open your web browser and type in 1) http://www.tinyurl.com/backchat passcode: necc
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WOScholar: Ture, Vicki. Sadly, though, many long term school folks see it as an addition. The challenge is to let them see the process of seamless integration. Hard to do if they will not be open minded.
WOScholar: True.
Julie Lindsay: I think it is OK to use the term Web 2.0 generically...it does not mater if it is not defined exactly
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WOScholar: Who ever had the most Followers on Twitter got chosen.
RickTanski: The focus on tWeb 2.0 tools for learning is more effective than 2.0 or 21st century skills as *results* or outcomes.
WOScholar: Just kidding.
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Vicki Davis: Passing fad or real deal?
RickTanski: Fad if it's a focus on the tools and not the learning.
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Julie Lindsay: built in pedagogy?
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Vicki Davis: You should have a student toolkit -- and then allow choice.
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Rotty: big deal
Jabiz Raisdana: A meta cognative look at what these tools allow kids to do it important
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Sandy Wagner: Pedagogy or paedagogy is the art or science of being a teacher. The term generally refers to strategies of instruction, or a style of instruction.
Sandy Wagner: Pedagogy or paedagogy is the art or science of being a teacher. The term generally refers to strategies of instruction, or a style of instruction.
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Teach42: Thanks for posting the backchannel. In Hall's presentation, but can double dip in here.
chris chater: this time next year we may be communicating at a similar session in Google Wave
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Sandy Wagner: so how can a tool have a pedagogy be in a tool
WOScholar: No doubt, Chris.
Vicki Davis: Actually has totally changed the methods I use in the classroom - totally - it is the NEW PAPER, the NEW PEN
Chris Lehmann: @chrischatter --> or a tool we haven't heard of yet.
jutecht: How do you create/learn a toolkit if it isn't about the tool?
Vicki Davis: the problem is that the NEW ERASER hasn't really been perfected and that is the problem.
Gardenglen: Student choice on what tool to use is my goal too
WOScholar: The tool fits the pedagogical need and any other way to do it is a fad.
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Teach42: @vick Good analogy. No matter how well you erase, there still tends to be artifacts left behind.
Chris Lehmann: It's not about the tool until it is about the tool. It's a false dichtomy, I think.
jackie: Any room left? was full according to the schedule
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Chris Lehmann: jackie -- tons of room.
jackie: In 206??
Vicki Davis: @Sandy - I don't really understand what you're asking -- in the strategies of instruction you can use these tools as part of it - so I'm going to do cooperative groups and use a wiki;.
Vicki Davis: etc.
jutecht: @jackie there is room left here.
Vicki Davis: It is about learning.
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snbeach: This chat goes with which session?
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Vicki Davis: @jackie - Classroom 2.0 isn't full - it is a new session.
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Gardenglen: My core includes collaboration & analysis but not specific tool use
Vicki Davis: @snbeach - this is with Classroom 2.0
Dianne Krause: Yay I made it in.. finally!
snbeach: thanks Vicki
jackie: Online?
Vicki Davis: but join in if your session isn't so exciting. '-)
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Vicki Davis: @jackie - unfortunately I do not think this is being streamed.
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Sandy Wagner: i believe i heard one of the questions as "do the tools havea pedagogy" and it would be more appropriate to say are the tools supportive of pedagogy
Vicki Davis: But if someone in the audience wants to bring up the stream and throw the link in the backchannel, go for it.
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Vicki Davis: Ah, Sandy - that makes sense.
Chris Lehmann: @djakes -- what does it mean to be well-educated in the 21st Century? Great question. (And what does that mean for instruction?)
jepcke: @vicki...done about 5 mins ago
Laura Deisley: the conversation needs to be outside the technology "dept" and it needs to be top down, bottom up about what it means to be well-educated and a learner in the 21st century
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Julie Lindsay: @Sandy good point...
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jepcke: Including admin AND teachers in the discussion is crucial...maybe even students
WOScholar: What is the end goal? Does technology offer a way to be more efficient AND effective in the learning process of reaching the goal? If so, which one is best? Then, how do you find the best way to make it seamless? Those are the questions we ask before just using a tool.
Vicki Davis: @Laura - actually, sometimes projects can be implemented on a school wide basis like our http://flintriver.ning.com and you just do it -- every teacher ended up blogging because of it.
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snbeach: @Laura it is part of seeing 21st C as more than just technology driven-- and instead seeing it as learning driven-- encompassing all that relates to school
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chris chater: Alan November stressed the degree of studnt run and directed learning that valitates all these tools
jutecht: @chrislehmann how do we know what we want? Were is that common understanding coming from. Government?
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Laura Deisley: @snbeach agreed
spedteacher: Include parents and the community, too. Too many ed decisions are made by those inside the box without input from those outside.
Vicki Davis: @WOScholar - the tool should be selected by what you want to do - if I want to hit a nail into wood I pick a HAMMER - I wouldn't pick a screwdriver - the struggle is that it is hard for some teachers to clearly see the fit between the job and the tool.
Cathyjo from SC: must rethink the pedagogy
shareski: Room 206?
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Cathyjo from SC: 206B
shareski: Save me a spot...be there in a second
Vicki Davis: @spedteacher - we have an incredible ability for inclusivity if we use it - the problem is when we include people and then ignore their thoughts.
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WOScholar: Not me. If it is on Twitter, it's gospel. ;)
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snbeach: RT: what does it mean to be well-educated in the 21st Century?
chris chater: We spend so much time planning curriculum of STUFF will they remember stuff?
jepcke: learning is learning
paulrwood: Sitting with @mikegras
Dougsawyer: Well said Vicki
Laura Deisley: @vicki Every teacher blogging is not an end goal for me.
WOScholar: @Vicki That's what I said. So we agree.
Rotty: @jutecht i think this need to be a grouds up common understand, the users of the tools will define what the tools are.
wiecb: yes, but there was as much MISinformation as correct information...check it here: http://technologizer.com/2009/06/25/twitter-the-fastest-way-to-get-informed-or-misinformed/
Cathyjo from SC: @Laura me either
snbeach: well developed skill in connecting and collaborating safely and ethically
Julie Lindsay: stuff becomes less important in a learning environment that values process above content
Vicki Davis: @laura -- No, that shouldn't be the goal - but every teacher communicating in spaces with their students and knowing how to use it
jutecht: @rotty ground up in each school? or at a State/Fed level?
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spedteacher: @vickidavis decision makers have a terrible habit of not listening to what they're told. We all come in with too many preconditions and iron-clad preferences.
snbeach: there is misinfo in texts and classrooms too
Cathyjo from SC: @snbeach I'll say (re misinformation)
Chris Lehmann: @jutecht Great question... I go back to big things... "thoughtful, wise, passionate and kind."
Vicki Davis: @laura - it is about what you want to do - in this case, the students were out on the river and needed to take pictures of endagered mussels and send it back to the Ning so the mussels could be released - there was apurpose for hte Ning that enabled us to accomplish our objectives.
jutecht: @snbeach misinfo is what Twitter is known for. :)
RickTanski: Aack! Blasphemer! That's not what the salesperson said. ;-D
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jepcke: Good point Sylvia.
Gardenglen: Web 2.0 tools do empower child - teacher must be willing to give up some control
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Anne Collier: There seems to be a growing divide between formal and informal learning (all that kids learning outside school in social media) - do u all see that as a problem?
jutecht: @chrislehmann----Agree. If you can get your school to take that one, have that vision then you are focused on learning.....I wonder how many schools are there.
snbeach: What did Sylvia say?
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D. Draper: This focus on technology should actually come from the curriculum department. This is about teaching - not tools.
paulrwood: drop the ego for the teacher and model learning and using things appropriately
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Anne Collier: Agree - about teaching/learning, not tools!
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jepcke: @snbeach That web 2.0 can enable relationships and connections, but it's not built in (but she said it much better)
Cathyjo from SC: @paulwood thats my mantra too
snbeach: @D.Draper-- smart
WOScholar: We have come to the conclusion it is not going to be fixed from the top down or the bottom up. You have to look at the goals of the need. Build back from that. It will expand itself. Every need will have different goals and require different tools (or no tools).
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Jim Klein: @ddraper the focus should not be on technology at all. The technology should serve as a platform for learning.
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Vicki Davis: @woscholar -- hmmm - interesting thought to consider.
D. Draper: @paulrwood I agree. I try to utilize the ego of the teacher to the advantage of the kids. Show them how much learning CAN take place using technology.
Sandy Wagner: if 1 teacher knows how to use it well it may be great for a few students-- if we want to see tools change SCHOOLS we need to train our teachers
tjmeister: Sometimes you can't wait for just the right tool to come along... If I don't have a hammer, I could use a rock for now, until I find a hammer.
Anne Collier: Chris Lehmann's YouTube vid got me thinking about how social media is just the new books! Need to stop talking about tech so much - we don't talk about books that much, 'cept maybe the content of 'em ;-)
Dianne Krause: @ddraper - yes! Often this stuff comes from the tech dept, not curriculum... we must bring curriculum folks into our fold and help them see the light on 21st c skills
snbeach: @WOScholar so you feel curriculum/change should be goals driven?
Rotty: so true, the model lessons here are very helpful on what the possiblities are with a tool, rather than teaching the tool mechanics
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Joe: We need a tool to capture informal learning going on between schools and students learning the same content in different places that is safe to use.
jepcke: We don't even put the world technology on our PD...it's about literacy or creating engaging learning environments, reading/writing
Jim Klein: @ddraper ...should be broad and flat. Something teachers AND students can stand on. A platform for innovatioon
ecram3Marcie: IWB can empower students if the teacher gives up the pen
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Sandy Wagner: you were taught to use a paper and pencil at some point
Vicki Davis: @Sandy - well every teacher learned how to use it but they learned by technology creep - use the tool and then empower students to help the teachers get on with it.
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Gardenglen: Imho Web 2.0 is about allowing students to reach higher Marzano levels by their choice - not based on teacher decisions
spedteacher: tools are great because they help you make things. Its fine to appreciate the beauty of a hammer, but you still have to pound the nails and build something to make it functional.
Dougsawyer: I agree it is not about tools but saying that doesn't solve the problem that teachers need to know and understand how and when to use the tools.
jutecht: "Just in time leanring works" and is still about the tool. You have to know where to click to create a new blog, a new group, etc in a Ning in able to use that. That learning...like with kids needs to be embedded.
Bud: you have to excite the teacher about the tool
WOScholar: @snbeach Wouldn't it be need driving the goals of the need? Does that make sense?
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Cathyjo from SC: nice way to say it CHRIS!!
Vicki Davis: @Sandy - it depends on the tool and the use of the tool -- not every teacher is as simple as that
snbeach: @Sandy within the context of doing worksheets for learning though-- the pencil and paper were not taught in isolation.
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chris chater: A.N. suggested all teachers in PD workshops should be accompanied by two students to change the learning style
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jutecht: @spedteacher and you need to learn how to hold and swing a hammer. My dad taught me.
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snbeach: @WOScholar-- nope--help me understand
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Dougsawyer: @ A.N and Chris that would be cool!
Julie Lindsay: http://tinyurl.com/backchat
Julie Lindsay: password necc
snbeach: @jutecht but he taught you to hold and swing the hammer within the context of building something-- right?
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wiecb: what was the significance of using Ning though? Sounds like an awesome activity, but people have been doing that way before Ning...
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jutecht: @snbeach...yes...it has to be in context...which is why computer lab classes don't work...not in context of learning.
tjmeister: but I bet you smacked you thumb a few times before you got the hang of it...but it healed...
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spedteacher: @jutecht yes, you have to know how to use the tool properly, but you still have to have an idea of what you're building with it. The tool has to fi whatever it is you are building with it and it needs to be used at the right time in the right way. Using a hammer on glass is a bad idea.
Sandy Wagner: @snbeach agreed, not taught in isolation-- taught within the construct of effective pedagogies using collaborative tools
snbeach: @jutecht smiling and nodding..
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Jabiz Raisdana: I met one of Chris Lehman's students before I met him online. She led me to SLA. So open is good!
jutecht: @snbeach it has to be in context for both teachers and students.
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Gardenglen: web 2.0 requires teachers to be willing to "step off the stage"
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RickTanski: @vicki can you relay the questions for those not in the room?
Dianne Krause: (will this chat be available after the fact for going back, etc?)
Chris Lehmann: Jabiz -- you met Hannah, right?
Julie Lindsay: students are already in a flattened learning environment
jepcke: there's a difference between lack of brick and mortar schools and extending the learning beyond the walls.
Vicki Davis: OK, so how do I zoom in on this without leaving the chat without having a mouse - does this need to be bigger.
snbeach: @jutecht-- absolutely.
Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): Hello folks
D. Draper: How much interaction with the world outside of school is appropriate for school activities? It depends on the student, class, and school.
Jabiz Raisdana: Yup.
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Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): there's some names here I recognize
Chris Lehmann: She rocks. :)
Vicki Davis: @Rick - sure -- I can -- what is your question.
jutecht: @spedteacher Teachers jb to know what to build.....my job (Ed Tech) to help them pick the tool and swing the hammer.
Jim Klein: @spedteacher who HAS to know how to use the tool? Why must we limit it with the term "properly"?
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dlaufenberg: @jabiz... she's in Russia for the summer in a language program... she was very excited!
briangrenier: @Gardenglen Web 2.0 requires teachers to set the stage
ecram3Marcie: @djakes bringing it back to KIDS! you can always rely on him for that!
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RickTanski: Draper already rewrote Steve's question.
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Jabiz Raisdana: @dlaufenberg yeah I know. We stay in touch.
WOScholar: @snbeach I cannot go to a teacher and say podcasting is a fit. They tell me what they are going to do with it and why it fits the need of the curriculum. Inversly, I do not go to them and say "Hey, you need to be podcasting." They need to see the need for it.
davidjakes: Think about making it glocal
Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): GardenGlen amen your speech. Heard something yesterday Interactive whiteboard emphasizes the front of the room do you agree?
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snbeach: @ecram3Marcie- what did he say? Just in chat-- not room
davidjakes: A combination of local connections than enable skill development, and then extend that into a global audience
Vicki Davis: You should be able to work with students that reprsent all socioeconomic, culture, and geographic backgrounds before graduation
LarryMagid: I think it was OK for people to check with CNN before believing Twitter chat on MJ's death. CNN got it from the LA Times & the LA Times got it from the doctors. Its all about having a verifiable source.
snbeach: making it glocal-- interesting. :)
Wesley Fryer: @snbeach are you here in the room in person? I'd love to say hello in person! :-)
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Anne Collier: On the formal/informal learning divide - so agree with Jakes that schools need to be in social media so they can help shape and enrich students' experience with it. Social media, like books, need to have a learning aspect.
Jabiz Raisdana: If we are preparing kids to be global and interactive in the world they have to first be able to trust it.
jepcke: Chris Lehman: from social networking to educational networking...need to teach kids the difference
davidjakes: how could you use this technology (chatzy) to have a backchannel chat in your classroom?
jutecht: @jabiz can you trust it? How do you learn to trust it? Do we teach that?
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snbeach: @Wesley Fryer you know darn well if I was in that room I would have come and sat with you..
stacey: people might need the number read...had to ask 2 people to get on here...
Jim Klein: @Jabiz Raisdana so do we.
Vicki Davis: Start in a protected area but have to move global before that.
jutecht: @davidjakes...do it with MS students all the time. :)
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WOScholar: @snbeach If the need is to make the classroom more transparent for parents, podcasting or video streams might be the right choice of the goal of transparency is to showcase the daily events/processes/etc.
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Anne Collier: A 19-yr-old student from Mexico said in my preso yesterday that she had to learn not to FEAR the Internet!
Rotty: the latest coomments deal with digital citizenship very important to kids for thier futures
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davidjakes: How would you use Chatzy, and a backchannel, to create a discussion about instruction, content, etc.
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Jabiz Raisdana: I think Chris just answered that. Teachers who can mentor them through the paranoia and hype help kids learn to trust and understand signs of danger.
ecram3Marcie: @snbeach - he was talking about were to start and how the community school leaders and students need to be included in that conversation, basically saying studnets need to be in the room for these conversations
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Katie: @anne that is so sad - teacher prep needs to step up
Wesley Fryer: @snbeach OK! I am sitting in the back and there are lots of folks here, so I just wanted to check. Sorry I missed you.
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snbeach: @WOScholar like chosing the right tool for the task? Is that what you mean?
jutecht: @AnneCollier I think that's a good thing to remember. There is a lot of fear around the Internet still. I have a dad who won't let his 10th grader on the Internet.
davidjakes: What happens when the walls of your classroom become permeable?
Gardenglen: Jprgie - an IWB really gets it's power from having students use it - NOT the teacher
jackie: Another reason for elimating bircks and mortar WALLS -
stacey: teachers find creative ways around the blocking in my district
ecram3Marcie: good online lesson for kids "if it smells like a rat, it is a rat" tell an adult
Dougsawyer: @david jakes first you would have to get chatzy unblocked
Chris Lehmann: @jabiz -- I think schools do need to be VERY deliberate in how they do it, though. We cannot leave this to chance that the kid gets the "right" teacher in a school who teaches these lessons.
jackie: eliminating
snbeach: @Wesley Fryer let's chat soon.
Jim Klein: @davidjakes People can see your dirty laundry ;-)
jepcke: or do we need to change our 'internet safety' info away from fear-based
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paula: you have a paradigm shift when you look at Iran and how they cannot close their borders due to web2.0 they cannot control everyone
Anne Collier: Agree, Katie! "Online safety," my own field (sorta) has become a BARRIER to proper learning!
jutecht: @VickiDavis how many other teachers in your school are "connecting students" like you are?
briangrenier: @davidjakes The teacher is no longer the expert...scary thought for many educators
Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): @podcasting, That's the conversation I love having "What do you want to do?" Ok, here's the tool you probably need to do it
Laura Deisley: We need to mentor students, but those of us who understand and are evolving our practices need to mentor and coach alongside teachers
davidjakes: @Dougsawyer. Who is doing the blocking?
Chris Lehmann: @jimklein I have NO desire to see @dajkes' dirty laundry.
jackie: Online safety and online censorship is too different things
WOScholar: @snbeach Close, but in the instructional mode the pedagogy has to be considered. The transparency example does not show that part of the equation. Sorry.
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snbeach: @ecram3Marcie @djakes is wise.
Vicki Davis: @jutect - more every year!!!
Wesley Fryer: I think Chris' point on mentorship is really valid. This points out how "the good learning environment" is so much more than technology use and access
Gardenglen: Teachers who choose what tool to use do a disservice to student growth
Jim Klein: @Chris Lehmann he he.
Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): hey do you all know about the @activtweets promethean board contest. Trivia question at 2 pm first one back in with the answer wins
Wesley Fryer: @snbeach ok!
Anne Collier: Yes, @jepcke! Would so love to ally with educators to LOSE THE FEAR! (netfamilynews.org, connectsafely.org)
snbeach: Reverse mentorship should be business as usual in classrooms
Sandy Wagner: "Higher order living"????? What is that supposed to mean? I can share my version of reality with the world?
Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): Gardenglen clarify???
Vicki Davis: @jutect - technology is transforming our school but it isn't like some sort of evercleanse diet but is more like a gradual process
WOScholar: @Djakes is eating Ketchup chips under the table when the other end of the table is talking.
jepcke: @anne great site newsletter
davidjakes: @Jim Klein. Cold.
Dianne Krause: Question from Kelly Hines - what do we do about the pushback from home? Parents dont understand
paula: what does that mean to educators when governements cannot control their virtual borders, what are we trying to control?
Vicki Davis: If you share a web address and start with www or http it wilinto a URL.
Laura Deisley: @snbeach right, and we need to let our students do more mentoring as well
Anne Collier: Can I have some of those ketchup chips?
jepcke: The proff is in the putting
Dougsawyer: @davidjakes In my district I access it, but I don't make the rules. Probably true for many.
jutecht: @vickiDavis how is that transformation happening. Curriculum or teacher do it if/when they want to?
snbeach: @Vicki Davis you mean the culture of education is such that change is incremental?
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Katie: @Anne - Heard a cool idea of getting the kids to start writing the aup and codes of conduct - can't remember what session i heard it at
Jorgie (@mbjorgensen): Sandy Wagner, to me "higher order living" is like "higher order thinking" it's about living a more abundant and fulfilled and fulfilling life
Vicki Davis: @Sandy - it is aoubout understanding and respecting others and appreciating cultural differences.
davidjakes: @dougsawyer. Does the tech dept or the curriculum department manage what sites are available?
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jepcke: @dougsawyer...are you in the room?
stacey: get your top administrators excited about technology helps too
jutecht: Great question about fear of the community! It is an issue...fear of parents....we must retrain parent communities as well.
briancsmith: we (educators) won't get this type of learning going, students will.
ehvickery: As geographic borders dissolve, who will undertake cyber certification for teachers?
Dianne Krause: We need to fight example by example, making our projects/models visible for the parents/school board
RickTanski: Education *is* the cure to fear.
ecram3Marcie: @smartinz - again I love this quote, "you can't tell ppl with words that this works, model it and show ppl childern can learn this way, own thier learning"
paulrwood: AUP should be about behavior not machines
Sandy Wagner: so it has nothing to do with teaching the curriculum approved by your Bd of education?
Jim Klein: @Katie totally agree with that strategy at the upper grade levels
Cathyjo from SC: @smartinez--amen
Anne Collier: Katie, absolutely. Contact Anne Bubnic for resources - abubnic@mac.com
Vicki Davis: @jutecth - Our curriclum director is driving a lot of oit, I pass things along to her and she integrates into the curriculum and recruits teachers to do different things
Julie Lindsay: you need to work as a whole school learning community and allow everyone to make informed decisons about flattening the school walls
ecram3Marcie: @djakes - do'n it for the kidz! YEAH!
snbeach: @smartinez indeed. Love her ideas-- powerful
WOScholar: What Sylvia is saying is a match for my thinking above. It is focused on the smaller parts of instruction and then works its way outward. Better than forced sit & git. Deeper thinking occurs when the focus is on the smaller part.
Vicki Davis: When she went to Qatar, each class had assignments and she skyped back to the whole elementary school while there to answer their questions.
Dougsawyer: Tech usually if the teacher asks for something to be unblocked it's done. However if it's a contraversial site it goes to Board or Sup first
Gardenglen: My moment of vision happened when students told another teacher what tool to use & how to use it. Teacher was shocked
jutecht: @VickiDavis what's the timeline for this...in your school to be "Just what we do"?
shareski: Hard to have conversations with kids when very few adults understand very little about how things are changing
Anne Collier: I love that - start with having conversations with kids - also, when bad stuff comes up! Teachable moments.
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Vicki Davis: Bugt these things take time!!! I only started 3 years a go! We've come light years !
Katie: @Anne thanks I will!
LarryMagid: Last week there was a suvey saying kids use mobile phones to "cheat" but maybe the schools are cheating kids by NOT letting them use mobile phones during trests (http://www.pcanswer.com/2009/06/22/cheating-is-cheating-but-tech-offers-chance-to-teach-critical-thinking/)
jackie: There is an assumption there by Chris that all parents have emails - several of students' families do not
Cathyjo from SC: My school does that too --lame IMHO but it is understood by parents
Vicki Davis: @jutecht - If I knew that perhaps I should be delivering keynotes like Gladwell, hmm?
LarryMagid: i meant "tests" not "trests" --
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jutecht: Kids all about the ME. That's why the love facebook. They don't want to Twitter...they twitter because we ask them too.
Dianne Krause: We need to give parents the small reasons/baby steps so they are ready to take the bigger steps/global - Chris Lehmann
snbeach: @jutecht 20 somethihngs Twitter
jutecht: @VickiDavis :)
Anne Collier: CA just passed a law that allows suspension for cyberbullying - that's no solution!
Cathyjo from SC: parent workshops on the tools are powerful--too bad not all parents come
Vicki Davis: But I do tknow that "change it is a comin" and it is a happening and it is real - we've had more change since I started trying to push it down their throat with workshops and moved it to a 1:1 mentoring program using students and my time.
jackie: Then the "systems" need to be more proactive in getting "access" to all families
Julie Lindsay: Invitation to join our Digiparent ning http://digiparent.ning.com/
Chris Lehmann: jackie -- I don't forget that -- but you can also send those emails to cell phones, and cell phones are almost ubquitious.
dlaufenberg: @jutecht SLA students chose to start Twittering b/c they wanted to...no one using it 'for class' and it grew organically to quite a few kids...
Jason: I see issues where teachers get it, but it is the site principal and key decision makers have issues with implementing these tools. There needs to be alignment with school plan and these tools needs to be integrated in the school site plan
jackie: Thanks Chirs
jutecht: @snbeach exactly.....and they blog. teens, Facebook, notes, status update. It's a developmentally thing...I think.
jackie: Chris
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Anne Collier: Hear, hear, Vicki!
ecram3Marcie: @jackie - we also use the "sneakernet" @ SLA we make a point to get this to all parents, this is also the Advisor's job every teacher has 20 students they advocte for in the building
Dianne Krause: Vicki - do you offer workshops for parents? What do you all do to teach the parents?
stacey: I sent text message blasts to my students this year...they loved it!1!!
RickTanski: @Larry I think that kind of cheating means we as educators are authentically assessing our kids.
snbeach: If change is happening exponentially in the workd and incrementally in schools-- shouldnt we be fierce about reculturing schools so that schools catch up with the pace of change
WOScholar: @jutecht Exactly. Too many folks go looking for a way to use a tool in a lesson. It has to start with the need of the lesson. No reason to be cool when being effective is so much more important.
Chris Lehmann: @dlaufenberg And I just got a Facebook message from a kid who needs help with a summer school scheduling issue.
jutecht: @dlaufenberg that's great....but I'd say SLA students are not the norm would you?
Dianne Krause: So funny he just asked that as I was typing?
Vicki Davis: @stacey w- what program did you use?
D. Draper: What are we doing to teach our parents?
stacey: Parent education is soooo necessary.
shareski: AUPs are usually CYAs in disguise.
timbest: @jutecht I think they all picked up twitter when they saw us using it
Dougsawyer: I had an issue with a kid bullying on Glogster last year. Both parents contacted and discussed issue. Discussed issue with kids. It was resolved without blocking the site. In some cases I think the site would have been blocked immediately.
jutecht: @snbeach....can schools catch up?
Jim Klein: @dlaufenberg that's the way it should be. Kids and teachers having access to a broad array of tools without the limits of "systems" and let 1000 flowers bloom.
shareski: AUPs are usually CYAs in disguise.
Chris Lehmann: @jutecht but they weren't necessarily super, super saavy when we got them... they were given access to the world and they ran w/ it.
Anne Collier: Vicki has Digiparents.ning.com. Also come to NetFamilyNews.org and ConnectSafely.org - glad to help talk with parents.
Jason: Virutal PTA meetings??
Jabiz Raisdana: Parents are just as hungry to learn as anyone. They come and get involved.
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Dianne Krause: lol @shareski
jutecht: @timbest yes...and there was a reason for it.... :)
ecram3Marcie: shareski - what is a CYA?
D. Draper: I still prefer the term "Responsible Use Policy". Teach with the policy.
Vicki Davis: @Diane - the students do our digital citizenship action projects and I've given them the choice to train parents - last year I did a session and had 30 parents!!
stacey: Parents NEED to be on their kids facebook!!!
gardenglen: had a great chance to let my students share what they did w/ web 2.0 tools to visiting Superintendent. He asked about having the idea shown at a PD in district.
RickTanski: If we want our parents to become educated, we have to make it part of the essential communication process.
jutecht: @chrislehmann exactly and would you say the majority of students have that access?
Jim Klein: @D. Draper Well put.
jepcke: @shareski So true re: AUP, that's the whole point unfortunately
snbeach: @jutecht-- if they reculture-- like when they changed from Dames schools to collective education of the massess under Horace Mann. Everything changed. It can change again.
Wesley Fryer: @ddraper that is a great question on parent education. Someone suggested awhile back coffee chats via the PTA/PTO that are periodic, throughout the year. I think that's a great idea.
nnorris: @Anne NetFamilyNews is where I send my parents!
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gardenglen: had a great chance to let my students share what they did w/ web 2.0 tools to visiting Superintendent. He asked about having the idea shown at a PD in district.
jutecht: @snbeach....my fingers are crossed. :)
LarryMagid: I am SO happy to see that people are realizing that "online safety" as a separate sujbject is meaningless.
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snbeach: @jutecht-- uncross your fingers and roll up your sleeves.
Dougsawyer: @stacey I agree but kids are savy enough to make 2 accounts one for there parents to see and one for their friends to see.
Jim Klein: @Wesley Fryer IT and ET should be scheduling time to chat with PTA/PTO at least twice a year.
Jason: anyone doing virtual parent conferences?? Using skype? Eluminate? Connect?
WOScholar: @wfryer We are implementing that this coming school year. Coffee chats with parents covering tools the kids use, our website and using it, online safety, etc.
chris chater: we can learn these tools from the students themselves - it comes with practice
Dianne Krause: Personal goal when I get back - set up something for our district's parents - get kids involved, get them to do the teaching and teach the parents what they've been doing with the tech in my school
Chris Lehmann: @jutecht in the US, the recent studies suggest that access is quickly becoming less and less of a problem.
snbeach: @Jason-- I will now. Thanks.
jutecht: @jason we do parent trainings once a month.
Jabiz Raisdana: @D. Draper Facebook comment! Nice.
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Julie Lindsay: I can remember when I first heard about wikis.......I felt like crying in relief!
LarryMagid: Be careful not to overwhelm parents with tech.
Rotty: we also need to have the kids as part of the conversation. if we are just telling them what to do/not do it won't work. they can help set an appropriaste framework for safety
ecram3Marcie: find your nodes and funnel your information
stacey: The truth is there is no such thing as "multi-tasking"...you just do one task at a time in very short segments...get it???
shareski: Lady is making a good point, most people in this room have relationships and the level of conversation is different for those who are outsiders.
Katie: @Julie - thanks for the resource - that is excellent!
jutecht: @chrislehmann that's great....so if access isn't the issue what is? Why are more schools not like SLA?
joycevalenza: It is important to remember that many others in the audience are overwhelmed. Vicki's story is helpful and reassuring
Chris Lehmann: @jutecht fear, uncertainty and doubt.
snbeach: @Because more admins aren't like Chris
Wesley Fryer: @woscholar that is GREAT. I would like to get that going at our school next year. Let's touch base later on this too. Are you going to integrate with Julie Lindsey's Ning or setup your own?
Nedra: @Vicki Davis where could I find out more about your digital action projects?
Jabiz Raisdana: Good question: Why are more schools not like SLA?
davidjakes: Start by joining Classroom 2.0
dlaufenberg: @jutecht re: SLA kids and the norm... the kids I worked with in AZ were not the norm after a few years as well... they took over tech roles in their churches and comm. organizations...
Julie Lindsay: @Nedra see our resources for Flat Classrooms etc at http://flatclassroomproject.org
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jutecht: @Chrislehmann so how do we get over the fear, uncertainty and doubt? Parent education, Teacher education, Admin education? D: All of the above
ecram3Marcie: more schools are not like SLA because of fear
stacey: but you're not completly focused on the one thing...you are only focusing on one or the other at any given moment
tjmeister: I wouldn't underestimate parents...the whole demographic is shifting...soon the parents will be demanding more openness...I will...
Chris Lehmann: @jutecht yep.
Jason: It is all about good pedagogy first! Need to scaffold these tools--differntiate for the various group of students--yes students and some of the newer parents are digital natives, but still at all different levels!
snbeach: @Jabiz because the culture/climate of SLA under Chris is different from the culture/climate in most schools-- and because most Admins simply have been left behind in the discussions.
chris chater: http://digiparent.ning.com/ is an excellent start too
Wesley Fryer: @jutecht I remember reading on your blog about some of those nights for parents. What topics resonated most or best with parents last year during those sessions?
timbest: @jabiz: sure, SLA has the tech, and the tech savvy teachers and principal...but the most striking thing in my mind is the community
WOScholar: @wfryer I need to take a look at her Ning, but our plan is to find what fits our community can fit into that. Sounds like another item for our camping list to discuss.
ecram3Marcie: I teach my students that multi-tasking is not possible
ecram3Marcie: there are studies
nnorris: @shareski We needed her to call that to our (the panel's) attention, Vicki's response is a good effort to reassure her.
Nedra: @Julie Lindsay Thanks
Sandy Wagner: There si no Multi-tasking-- we actually switch from task to task quickly
ecram3Marcie: why do you think there are laws against cell phones in cars
Laura Deisley: Saw a great school in a poster session where the students are tech liasons and resources for teachers and students. It's a big deal. We are going 1:1 in our middle school this year, and we are piloting a parent social network created and designed by upper school students to help them navigate our new learning environment and the important role parents will play with these computers and internet access coming home
spedteacher: @Chrislehmann SLA was stated from scratch, or was it the reformation of an existing school?
snbeach: @ecram3Marcie and there are studies that refute those studies.
jutecht: @WFryer Facebook, Youtube....we made it personal to them. Showed parents how they could use the tools for their own learning...then brought it back to the learning.
timbest: I'm with marcie on this one...I think multitasking is pretty much a myth
Jabiz Raisdana: @timbest I don't see SLa as tech, I see as a well run family. I see it in teh studnets I am in cotact with teh teachers and the admin. That is key.
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Vicki Davis: @ecram - hmmm - it depends on depends on context
davidjakes: Whats good is better than whats new (chris lehman)
timbest: @spedteacher: started from scratch
Jabiz Raisdana: sorry for the terrible typos,
jepcke: What's good is better that what's new. ~Chris Lehman
ecram3Marcie: @snbeach - tru dat ;)
Laura Deisley: @tbest and @ecram agreed
LarryMagid: "what's good is a better question than what's new." is a very profound comment.
jepcke: oops than not that
chris chater: @Wesley Fryer http://mscofino.edublogs.org/ has lots of info
Katie: lots of brain research out there on multi-tasking - wasn't it in brain rules
timbest: for example, I have no idea what lehmann is saying right now
Laura Deisley: @tim ha
dlaufenberg: I taught in a tech rich environment from 1997-2000 in KS. was doing VERY similar things with regard to project based/inquiry driven ed... its not all about the tools or having the coolest gadgets. its about the learning...
stacey: it might be too much going on...
ecram3Marcie: dovetail Chris Lehmann - and pick one tool and use it
paula: I agress
dahall: Pick on tool and get good at it
Jabiz Raisdana: I feel more a part of the conversation in the back channel.
dahall: share it
jepcke: IT allows for a level of discourse/discussion that wouldn't otherwise happen
LarryMagid: To the question is the back channel making it better -- i think the answer is "maybe."
Vicki Davis: Somone has to be "in charge" -- I am a backchannel moderator - it is my job. I am appointed! ;-)
dahall: help others be good
joycevalenza: i wonder if there is more to this question. Does the lady in front feel like an outsider a different type of learner?
shareski: Lady is making a good point, most people in this room have relationships and the level of conversation is different for those who are outsiders.
aforgrave: needs to be a plan to address the divide -- for students, for teachers, for parents, for administrators -- how to avoid "shock" or overwhelm
stacey: their backchannel is a rap song
spedteacher: Part of the problem is that we keep trying to change existing schools. That meets massive resistance. If you can start from scratch with a clear vision, as SLA did, the task is easier.
gardenglen: I use term HUB (Hands under Buttocks) works with my 7th grade students - for when they need to be engaged w/ me
paula: back channel is the whisperring at the back of the class
Dianne Krause: Kids have a backchannel in their heads already - Sylvia Martinez
jutecht: Just because there is a back channel doesn't mean you have to watch or take part. Works for some...not for others.
jackie: My aha is that some of us as teachers can multi-task and use the backchannel - but what are the students' perceptions? The audience in this case is the student. In other words, she has the perception that we cannot and her perceptions are important.
stacey: tuned to P.Diddy
LarryMagid: B.C. is somewha distracting
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snbeach: @Katie it is a connective fiber thing and a schemea thing huh? processing several streams at one time is easier for some than others because they have grown the connective fiber to allow it.
paula: sometimes they learn more from that whispering
jutecht: Back channel as note taking is great with Middle School students.
Jason: We have to look at MI theory.... we have the intrapersonal learners developing their interpersonal skills.... they need this "backchannel" scaffold to acquire those social skills
shareski: Great point by Sylvia.
D. Draper: Well put, Sylvia.
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RickTanski: Lots of kids' engagement in our classrooms probably look like a sine wave, interacting where they cross the X axis. Our job is to bring the amplitude closer to the axis, brining their engagement nearer.
chris chater: I'd like to see a faculty meeting in my school with a backchannel displayed like it is here
Jim Klein: @jutecht like chasing breadcrumbs if your not in the room
jepcke: IF Backchannel is distracting then you can disengage
Sandy Wagner: we can say what we want-- nobody is moderating
ecram3Marcie: shareski I agree with the relationship comments... how do we change that?
timbest: in this kind of session, I'd prefer face to face discussion...but perhaps the backchannel allows us to bring up points that there isn't time for?
aforgrave: but B.C. allows different folks to participate in different ways ---
Jabiz Raisdana: Back channels challange the idea of the sage on the stage. @Tim best mark that on your bingo card.
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dahall: I could not do the back channel if I was there it would be to much
aforgrave: but B.C. allows different folks to participate in different ways ---
timbest: @jabiz: got it. good one
snbeach: There is a pedagogy to backchanneling. For example-- having a chatmaster to help bring cohesiveness to the chat and integrate it with the speaker-- a facilitator
stacey: wow...fiesty
jackie: I like the backchannel but I will not put my learning style preferences on others.
ehvickery: I observed @vickidavis using back channel chat w/her students in her classroom. Effective, engaging, relevant. Brought out the kids who usually don't talk.
Vicki Davis: If you have a backchannel and you have it up someone has to moderate it.
jackie: It is about choice!
davidjakes: First step in a school should be a systemic approach to this, with the development of a common core vocabulary that sets the stage
Cathyjo from SC: those who use backchannels MUST use a person to tune in speaker to needs of backchannel
Anne Collier: The research shows that the brain doesn't really multitask, it's linear but just jumps from one thing to the next more rapidly, if that makes sense. So it's more a matter of constantly shifting focus.
MLM: Back channels help extend my learning, when I feel I am being stretched and not focusing as much as I want to then I stop.
snbeach: who is our moderator here?
chris chater: Vicki has a great slideshare on backchannel here: http://www.slideshare.net/coolcatteacher/backchannel-basics
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WOScholar: I plan to print and read through this one afterward. Gotta be some good stuff I am missing.
jutecht: @JimKlein It can't be a backchannel in the classroom it has to be a "front channel" it has to be part of the classroom not a seperate piece...that's when you get in trouble. :)
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jutecht: @snbeach Vicki Davis is moderator
Jason: you cannot have random acts of technology -- of course you need alignment
snbeach: @jutecht I am copying that quote and froming it.
Katie: @snbeach - that was it I think - connective fiber that has been established by the environment around them
ecram3Marcie: it lets everyone have access
snbeach: framing
Anne Collier: Backchannel's fine!
jackie: Anne - one of the characteristics of the brain is that of plascity - we really don't know how the brain is evolving due to the new technologies
Cathyjo from SC: and also challenges my thinking in the backchannel
D. Draper: "All your decision about curriculum, vision, pedagogy need to be made independent of the tools." Constructive critisism?
aforgrave: the "divide" in action
snbeach: @Katie it is a controversial topic with research supporting both sides. We simply need to explore it more.
shareski: Many of these arguements presume all or nothing
Vicki Davis: I think that perhaps I should ignore the backchannel?
James P: Any learning theories to support web 2.0? I have tried to research this area and have come with few, if any, peer reviewed docs supporting web 2.0 for learning? Thanks.
Sandy Wagner: she is not moderating-- sdhe simply createdx the channel and is watching it-- if it were moderated, we wouldnt see anything until approved by a moderator--
jackie: The use of the open forum and the chat is to allow all to have voice
jutecht: Back Channel to me means you're really not paying attention as a teacher/presenter/etc It's an add-on in the back ground.
D. Draper: Good point, Shareski. There's a definite balance that must be met.
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jepcke: ISn't this part of what a panel discussion should be? Push back
Cathyjo from SC: we would not be hee at NECC and other conferences if we did not crave f2f interaction with our virtual colleagues
dlaufenberg: @chrischater at my previous school we still, literally, passed notes... teachers=often no different than students
Jason: any research being down on student success, retenion, etc with the use of backchanneling?
Jason: *done
RickTanski: Students create their own communities, often very distinct from their physical ones, because they may see that those communities may not have anything to offer them.
nnorris: When I was a student, I backchanneled all day long....I called it "passing notes"
stacey: In such a large group, it might be in the best interest to have a moderator.
jepcke: challenging the thinking of the panel as well as the audience
Jim Klein: @davidjakes Be careful there. Systems tend to limit creativity and innovation, and to reinforce the status quo. They should be developed over time and exploration.
gardenglen: I'm one of the "weird" people who can read a back chanel and listen and think through concept being talked about
jutecht: @shareski if it was about balance I'd get 8 hours of sleep a night. :)
jackie: But with the right of voice comes the responsilibity to listen to and honor the perspectives of views that differ from our own.
shareski: At the same time, many of things such as backchannels are in their infancy, we're all trying to figure it out
snbeach: @Jason yep-- email me later and I'll send-- snbeach@cox.net
jackie: What is she wearing?
ecram3Marcie: why does it seem like Chis is defending what we do, we don't ever tell anyone what we do will work for you, figure out your community and what will work for them
WOScholar: Wondering why the backchannel slowed down during the heated discussion of having a backchannel. F2F was better at the time. We made the switch to the better mode at the moment.
stacey: :)
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jutecht: Definition of Back Classroom http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backchannel
Cathyjo from SC: @woscholar GREAT POINT
Jaten: @ddraper, I agree. Just heard Alan November, and a comment he made struck, "The question is what information and relationships do we want kids to get? The technology should be invisible." I've just realized, however, that the thing is, what is invisible to one is painfully apparent to another.
jutecht: Sorry Back Channel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backchannel
gardenglen: @WOScholar I lot connectivity durig the discussion
timbest: @woscholar: good point
jackie: GIVING A VOICE - I am thrilled to get a voice in a big session like this wereh I would not have this option. I am more engaged in this session due to it.
RickTanski: @WOScholar, that's our jobs as educators.
Teach42: @Vicki Nice video in Hall's presentation :)
Sandy Wagner: I am impressed that Sylvia has chosen to ingore the backchannel in the experiment. And she does look Fab!
jepcke: @jutecht never heard that term 'backclassroom', hmmm interesting
Chris Lehmann: I'd argue that the values you have *must* be the values you have, regardless of the milleau. Face to face or online... those values are what you do.
ecram3Marcie: try it, try anything, use a pencil on a stick... if it doesn't work to engage the kids, thow it out!
Katie: I would much rather add my thoughts into the backchannel - you can continue a conversation around a particular topic in the conversation that interested you
jutecht: Moderator needs to be "Part of the people" not part of the presentation?
stacey: We should all be professionals, yes?
davidjakes: Im using systems in the context that I want all kids to have an equitable experience in learning, and a systems approach can provide the framework for that
WOScholar: @gardenglen Good point.
chris chater: aren't educators supposed to model risk taking too?
aforgrave: needs to be a plan to address the divide -- for students, for teachers, for parents, for administrators -- how to avoid "shock" or overwhelm
Cathyjo from SC: @ddraper can speak to unwanted visitors in the back channel from his Open PD
WOScholar: @Rick Exactly. And we can both model and teach it.
Cathyjo from SC: it happens, move on
Julie Lindsay: Teachers and students need choices for learning
snbeach: @jutecht but do not let go of that premise you made-- I think you are on to something beyond a defined perspective (wikipedia) -- I think maybe the secret to retention and success is if the back channel became the front channel-- at least in the classroom
jutecht: Most teachers feel lost....there are over 18,000 educators here who are here about technology....and if some here are lost...what does that say about the rest of them?
James P: Why has this become a discussion about backchannel??
Jason: It allows the introverts to be able to be more confrontational!
jackie: Go back to individualized and personalized learning styles
shareski: Mints being passed about on the panel..someone has bad breath.
LarryMagid: JP == because we have a way of focusing on tools rather than goals
Julie Lindsay: backchannel is a tool...yes! however it allows for student empowerment and provides a voice for each and every memebr of the class....and extended class in a flatenned learning mode
Rotty: I could see using this in my class, I teach kids who learn differently and having the option of answering questions without having to speak, or to answer questions after having time to formulate an idea would be helpful
RickTanski: *****Students need to learn to think and explore ideas in a global world; the tech tools facilitate this.
jepcke: @jamesp Agreed
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jutecht: @snbeach....I agree totally. It has to be apart of the lesson/presentation/classroom it can't be "In the back" :)
snbeach: @Chris Lehmann so you are saying dispositions are the presenter where knowledge and skills not so much?
jpatten: what we don't want is a room full of people typng away and ignoring the face to face conversation...I'm not there so, its's ok for me :-) ... of course.
jepcke: It's not about the backchannel
aforgrave: risk taking -- leadership -- careful thought -- helping everyone to learn -- a significant challenge these days
Jim Klein: @davidjakes agreed. but most tend to lean toward old habits when developing those systems, which leads to limitations that reinforce the status quo. It's a tough balancing act.
Sandy Wagner: because the backchannel is live onscreen and one of the panelists is modering it.
D. Draper: Hey Jakes. Will you pass the ketchup chips?
snbeach: @jepcke but why couldnt it be?
jepcke: backchannel is allowing those not in the room to participate, etc
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Chris Lehmann: @shareski I admit... it was me. I didn't like my breath.
wiecb: @lehmann --- agreed SLA has integrated technology very well, but I would argue you're the exception.
gardenglen: Great suggestions have been made on Twitter about using Back Channel during a video. Students must make at least 1 comment or question or respond to question during the video. I link how it helps focus students.
jepcke: snbeach You lost me? Why can't what be?
Cathyjo from SC: @sylivia which is why the text book industry is ALIVE and well fiscally
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Julie Lindsay: Using a backchannel in class must be integrated pedagogically..have a purpose....be moderated and monitored
jutecht: Agree point...it's about money. Please se the exhibition center.
aforgrave: status quo is easy -- pushing the envelope is difficult, but folks don't do it to make life more difficult for others
Jim Klein: @jpatten I'd probably be ignoring much of this if I was in the room :-)
Jabiz Raisdana: It's about money: SMart, HP, ISTE, NECC...finally someone said it.
Chris Lehmann: @snbeach I'm not sure I understand what you're asking...
James P: How about finding a way to integrate what others are doing successsfully into a shared environment???
shareski: TEachers are quick to move to rules and structures, that's the system we grew up with. Many things we experience today are the anti-thesis of that.
Dougsawyer: @jepcke I'm in Alton, IL right now
LarryMagid: Agree with Sylvia. I'm a tech journalist and companies are always trying to get me to write about their new products -- so few are really innovative
snbeach: @jepcke It's not about the backchannel (you said)
James P: I mean people sitting in the audience.
jackie: It helps diffuse the power structure of the learning environment. Without this backchannel, there is strictly and literally sages on the stage. The backchannel at least gives me a little "power" with my written oice
stacey: reflective practictioners ... it's the buzz in technology
verybusyma: I am paying more attention with the backchannel
stacey: and education
WOScholar: This whole idea/topic/discussion is the reason we still have chalkboards and paper textbooks and poor progress in the area of technology use. Having chances like this to have good, true discussions with policy makers in the room JUST DOES NOT HAPPEN. (yes, I meant all caps)
Wesley Fryer: I really push back on this idea that "we should never talk about the TOOLS." It is ok to talk about the tools at times. We start with an awareness level knowledge of tools, move to a personal use, then go to the instructional level of use, both taking other's ideas and inventing our own. It is a process. It is ok to talk about the tools. We shouldn't feel guilty talking about the tools, esp with people who are not familiar with them AT ALL.
LarryMagid: The technology behind this back channel is 30 years old.
snbeach: practictioners for the most part are not reflective. Time conspires against them.
aldt: I'm in Maine, appreciating the ideas here, contemplating my new job, trying to gather all my thoughts.
gardenglen: I think the backchannel idea is a newer idea that has not been and is not promoted by "exhibitors" on the floor below us.
shareski: Rules and structurea have their place but I'm more interested in principles of learning that can be applied in a variety of contexts and environments
Chris Lehmann: @wes It's not about the tools until it is about the tools. :)
Anne Collier: Is it totally simplistic to ask if social media isn't just the new book? It's like we're back before the Reformation and the Renaissance when the book was considered really subversive, but it just became a learning tool! Same now with new media.
jutecht: I've learned I need to countine to think about this "front channel" idea. There are different ways to use the tool. Somethings it is a back channel that's different then using as part of your lesson for learning.
Julie Lindsay: @Larry good point! not everything is new.....but maybe how we are starting to use it in context with higher order learning processes?
snbeach: @Chris Lehmann it was in response to your values statement
jutecht: @djakes first we need to know what we want them to understand.
jackie: I learned that the audience/student perception of the tools-pedagogy highly influences the efficacy of the tool-pedagogy. It might be a great tool-pedagogy, but if the student has a negative perception of that tool=pedagogy, then it loses efficacy.
Jim Klein: @wfryer Sure, but that process needs to grow organically, rather than being enforced through scripts and specific usage requirements.
Katie: @Wesley Fryer - agreed - nothing is black and white - we should be able to do both - talk about tools and learning
Jason: @jackie It is very empowering to have some control of lesson, presentation, etc.
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shareski: Sometimes it is about the tools in that they all have a bias in how they are used. Every piece of software or hardware has a bias.
aforgrave: @gardenglen -- I agree --
jackie: Yes Jason
jepcke: @snbeach I mean that this web 2.0 in schools panel discussion has turned into an argument over the value of backchannels
Wesley Fryer: I have taken away a need and opportunity to facilitate parent education sessions at school.
Jabiz Raisdana: I've learned that communication on any level with any tool in any form is difficult. The transfering of ideas form one human mind to another is difficult and it takes time and patience. , but vital.
jepcke: not sure that was the focus here
gardenglen: Most teachers would be scared to have a back channel - it gives up power. I think showing it on screen is a fantastic idea - I'd like to have a student moderate it & rotate who that is.
davidjakes: What is the worst consequence of your best idea? (chris lehman)
aforgrave: there are things which cannot be done (by some, by all, or by anyone) without some "tools"
Nedra: @Wesley Fryer Good point, that's what I try to do when introducing new things at my school
Bud: I agree e that its not about the tools until the tools get us in trouble
jepcke: there is SOOO much more than backchannels
stacey: @gardenglen...totally agree
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WOScholar: @wfryer The problem is we do not offer sessions on how to use textbooks because teachers know that inherently. At some point they will get there with the tools. They need tool sessions to buy in and become comfortable with what is out there. A whole conference built on how to use tools, though, demeans the point of making good content and training good teaching staff.
snbeach: @jepcke oh sorry-- do not have the in the room perspective-- I'll hush -smile
jutecht: @Wes....we have to re-educate the community and it starts with parents. Parent support = change. :)
aforgrave: tools and technology transform us, we DO need to pause and understand which to use, why we use them
Wesley Fryer: Sylvia's point that we can't win this argument with a new AUP really resonates. We have to amplify great examples of student work and learning, that is what sways others. VERY good point, and inspiring for specific action.
Rotty: @jepcke i agree, but it is a symbol for the teacher /school /parent not being in control and the kids being empowered
LarryMagid: @Vicky Have you written about how you use back channel in your classroom. Link?
jepcke: @snbeach NO, no hushing.
jutecht: @WOScholar great point!
Chris Lehmann: @snbeach gotcha... I think "values" for me aren't political / cultural... they are pedgaogical. They lead us to a teaching style. Tom Hoffman tells me that I misuse the word, which I very well might be doing.
shareski: Attention Literacy by Howard Rheingold http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/rheingold/detail?entry_id=38828
paula: great to experience this with all of you
gardenglen: I'd like to start by having a backchannel during a faculty meeting - see how teacher enjoy doing it... then suggest use in classroom.
jepcke: @rotty I don't think that is really what the audience's point is. I respect that it is yours
MLM: @gardenglen good idea
aldt: I enjoyed Rheingold's Attention Literacy ideas.
Wesley Fryer: @jutecht yes, and that continuing conversation. I like continuing coffee chats rather than "just 1 internet safety night" preso. Definitely about the community, not just 1 constituent group.
Jim Klein: @wfryer Great point. A key aspect of successful technology programs is "celebrating successes"
verybusyma: good way to introduce it
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Jen: not arguring Garden Glen -- but why would you need a backchannnel if they are all sitting there F2F already??
Vicki Davis: Larry my backchannel is frozen
snbeach: @Chris Lehmann smile-- pooh on Tom.. keep playing with the idea.
jutecht: @julielindsay you have to try it to know if it will work....so true...I just hope schools allow teachers to try and fail...cause that's how you learn. If failure is not an option neither is trying.
Jason: backchannel=continuous think/pair/share
LarryMagid: It's time to eliminate "internet safety night." I've spoken at hundreds of them and they
ecram3Marcie: I think the clique issue needs to be addressed... there are ppl here that are friends and are happy to see each other and are communicating in sessions. New learners to ed. tech. can feel left out of the conversation
LarryMagid: miss the point
jepcke: @gardenglen I think it would be great to have kids backchannel when watching a speaker
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Wesley Fryer: @woscholar exactly. Our assumptions can't be that teachers know how to use collaborative writing enviroments. So it is ok to talk about those tools. I agree it should be contextualized with actual examples and actual uses. Doing rather than just seeing/ watching / theorizing. The DO curriculum for teachers as well as students.
aldt: Sometimes I have comments to share that aren't worth interrupting a discussion, oro sometimes there's not enough time for all to be discussed. BC allows me to shre without taking up time from group discussions?
briangrenier: @jutecht I'm using that quote..."If failure is not an option neither is trying."
jutecht: @Wes...our's are the first Wednesday every month. Coffee and Cake....foods the key for parents for educators. :)
snbeach: @jutecht-- just had a great idea for a new project-- we should talk.
shareski: The power of these conversations is that they stay with you and influence your thinking in the future
RickTanski: This backchannel addition has made my experience deeper in this session, even though it was experimental. It's readily obvious to me that fear and anxiety -especially regarding change- are foundational to many decisions we make in education. We react there instead of in students' best interests.
ecram3Marcie: these types of situations happen in any social context. How do you handle in it you classroom, or amoung your staff?
Chris Lehmann: @snbeach yes, ma'am.
stacey: good point!
jutecht: @snbeach......we can do that :)
snbeach: @shareski Tenniyson, "We are a part of all we have met" ideas live oin
shareski: @ddraper This conversation itself is really about a very small percentage of teachers. We are a very small minority
jepcke: That is the danger of hanging everything on the written word. F2F is critical. We can't only have written
snbeach: on
Jason: claps
jutecht: clap, clap, clap, clap, :)
timbest: people come to NECC for different reasons. Some love to learn the tools. Other are looking for "big ideas"
wiecb: just because people are critical, doesn't mean technology should be integrated in schools...
Wesley Fryer: @Jim Klein yes, That is a lesson I first heard loud and clear from Marco Torres. Empower students to share their community's voices, and celebrate them together.
paula: I agree Jason...new experiences are great not always something we all want to have again
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WOScholar: That was the fastest hour in a session all week. Seriously.
wiecb: "should NOT that is"
shareski: I need food
briangrenier: oooops I am late for a 10:45 appoinment
Jen: just realized this was the Steve Hargadon panel :)